Merger Continued

[racer2c]

Is worth doing well. Just ask Kevin Kalkhoven. The Champ Car co-owner talked a bit about his ongoing discussions with Indy Racing League founder Tony George concerning a potential merger of the two open wheel series.

"The important thing is to get it done right," said Kalkhoven. "When it comes to mergers and acquisitions in recent years, there hasn't been a high rate of success. The very worst thing that could happen for the sport would be for us to merge the two series and have it not work. So if we can get it done in time for next year that would be great. If it takes a little longer, then that's OK too."

Kalkhoven said he figured any merger would have to be completed by August if the two series were to run a unified schedule in 2007.

"We know pretty much how we would fit a schedule together, but the devil is in the details. So we'll continue to keep our heads down and work for the best interest of the two groups and try to get it done the best way possible. I hate to keep repeating myself but doing it right is Job One. The worst thing would be for us to do a deal just to do a deal and have it not work. It would be horrific. There are two series now that are doing OK and, of course, I'm particularly proud of ours. To throw that away in pursuit of a merger would be a terrible mistake."

Nothing earth shattering but notice he said they have an idea on a schedule. I think they are really trying for a '07 merge.

Link (http://www.speedtv.com/articles/champcar/auto/22964/)

[Andrew Longman]

Nothing earth shattering but notice he said they have an idea on a schedule. I think they are really trying for a '07 merge.

Link (http://www.speedtv.com/articles/champcar/auto/22964/)

07 makes the absolute best sense. Honda money will be gone from the IRL. New chassis. No one want to keep talking about this for another two years. It will only make sponsorship more uncertain and whatever buzz it could create will be old.

I imagine the difficulty is in making contracted promoters whole if they come off the schedule and agreeing on who the new organization would be governed.

The teams in both series only care that the I500 is on the schedule and that they can gain sponsorship to pay for whatever equipment they need to run. If they announce early enough this year (I'd say June or July) and go with the DP01/Cosworth design (and to me no other alternative available in 07 is better from a cost and performance POV) they will know exactly what their budgets will be and have plenty of time to sell sponsorship for it before marketing budgets are set for 07.

And of course the biggest challenge is to let TG think he won. ;)

[Stu]

If they do not get enough work done in time to merge the series for the 2007 season, it would not surprise me to see them run a unified Indy 500 next year.

That way they can at least show that they are on the way to merging and 2008 will be the first unified year. It would get Champ Car back into the 500 and Tony would get his 33 cars.

Thats assuming FTG can find a rule book to combine with Champ Car's and come up with some solid rules so a certain little lady has to pit when the pits are actually open. Minor details like that would have to be worked out. ;)

[Skater_36]

07 makes the absolute best sense. Honda money will be gone from the IRL. New chassis. No one want to keep talking about this for another two years. It will only make sponsorship more uncertain and whatever buzz it could create will be old.

I imagine the difficulty is in making contracted promoters whole if they come off the schedule and agreeing on who the new organization would be governed.

The teams in both series only care that the I500 is on the schedule and that they can gain sponsorship to pay for whatever equipment they need to run. If they announce early enough this year (I'd say June or July) and go with the DP01/Cosworth design (and to me no other alternative available in 07 is better from a cost and performance POV) they will know exactly what their budgets will be and have plenty of time to sell sponsorship for it before marketing budgets are set for 07.

And of course the biggest challenge is to let TG think he won. ;)


2007 makes the most sense for both series but I can appreciate the fact that there are numerous details to work out. I hope they can bring it together in time. I believe the most time consuming factor will be figuring out places to put certain management personnel for face saving purposes.

[Spicoli]

Gettin all kinda reports today from both camps this is a done dealio.\

GOOD. :thumbup:

[rabbit]

Gettin all kinda reports today from both camps this is a done dealio.\

GOOD. :thumbup:
I am upgrading my status from skeptical to cautiously optimistic on whether or not this happens.

I don't want to get burned again. :thumdown:

I want a merger so bad I can taste it. But I'm going to wait for the official announcement before I start celebrating.

[Racing Truth]

I am upgrading my status from skeptical to cautiously optimistic on this.

I don't want to get burned again. :thumdown:

Yep, but if true... w00t! :thumbup: :cool:

My guess is still some sort of May announcement.

[gerhard911]

I am upgrading my status from skeptical to cautiously optimistic on this.

Based on what I have seen posted around today (not that I put much faith in what I read on message boards), I am downgrading my status as a fan of CCWS from solidly optimistic about the future to nervously pessimistic that what will result will be as attractive to me as the WNBA :shakehead








(not that there's anything wrong with that) [/SEINFELD]

[RusH]

I can finally go to the Indy 500! :gomer:















I`ll wait for the announcement :rolleyes:

[Racing Truth]

Based on what I have seen posted around today (not that I put much faith in what I read on message boards), I am downgrading my status as a fan of CCWS from solidly optimistic about the future to nervously pessimistic that what will result will be as attractive to me as the WNBA :shakehead








(not that there's anything wrong with that) [/SEINFELD]

1. What have you read that bothers you?

2. Unless its significant, keep this in mind: Seabass practically said all OW drivers would be w/o a job minus a merger. So while it may not be perfect, would you rather see the whole sport flirt w/ extinction?

[cart7]

I'm ready. Just hope as KK says, they get it right the first time, I'd hate to see this thing fall apart a couple years into it, I no longer have a heart for another split and this one has become boring.

Cautiously optimistic here.

[Racing Truth]

I'm ready. Just hope as KK says, they get it right the first time, I'd hate to see this thing fall apart a couple years into it, I no longer have a heart for another split and this one has become boring.

Cautiously optimistic here.

The vibe I get is that IFFFFF this goes down, Tony and Kevin are on the same page here. The only thing to potentially worry about is the other owners getting all pi$$y and '79 repeats itself.

Thing is though, they won't have many venues to play with, so this might not be a huge worry.

[pferrf1]

The vibe I get is that IFFFFF this goes down, Tony and Kevin are on the same page here. The only thing to potentially worry about is the other owners getting all pi$$y and '79 repeats itself.

Thing is though, they won't have many venues to play with, so this might not be a huge worry.

There are only two groups left in this sport in NA that have the cash to do it. TG/IMS and KK/GF/CCWS. The owners have been propped by these guys for so long, sidepods are blank, most of the teams can barely survive as it is. They'll go along........

[G.]

I no longer have a heart for another split and this one has become boring.
Spot on.

I would be wizzed if FTG had a >49% stake in it, but I too am fed up.

If the product remains great (ie., not crap earl), then I think I could stomache it. "It" being FTG.

[gerhard911]

1. What have you read that bothers you?

2. Unless its significant, keep this in mind: Seabass practically said all OW drivers would be w/o a job minus a merger. So while it may not be perfect, would you rather see the whole sport flirt w/ extinction?

The mix of tracks and races rumored to be excluded are most troubling (STRCOMP thread in the Dumpster @ CW). The involvement of honduh's RC (supposedly had lunch with KK today) makes me very nervous as well.

I trust KK is smart enough to do the right deal if he's in it for the long haul but I'm getting nervous that he might be looking to walk away with a pocket full of TG & honduh cash.

If the sport collapses it wouldn't be the first time for me. I was a huge fan of the original Can-Am ;)

[Stu]

I'd like to see a merger for obvious reasons that don't need to go stated.

But what happens when we have Flashinthepanica pitting when the pits are closed and not being penalized for it so she has a good finish?

Will we have a rule book or just something that is randomly made up?

Will they have boring oval races that always always always seem to end in a photo finish because of the way cars are set up.

It could be great for the sport if they two got back together and the best open wheel teams were competing against each other, but it could really hurt the good things about champ car that could be lost if Tony gets his way on some things.

edit: I am sure all this has been said before, its just what I was thinking as I set the DVR up to record the race tomorrow.

[Andrew Longman]

My son said the Speed News is reporting that Robert Clarke, MA, Rahal, and Gannassi had lunch with KK at LB today.

I wonder what they dined on. Crow?

[Turbodog]

Gettin all kinda reports today from both camps this is a done dealio.\

GOOD. :thumbup:

dood that would be way cool

[Lizzerd]

http://www.mortonsalt.com/images/products/IodizedPlain_Salt.jpg

[formulaben]

The vibe I get is that IFFFFF this goes down, Tony and Kevin are on the same page here. The only thing to potentially worry about is the other owners getting all pi$$y and '79 repeats itself.

That's getting ahead of the game, but unfortunately it's a legitimate concern...if that happens, then I would think the entire concept of open-wheel racing in North America is toast. I doubt many have the stomach for a 3rd civil war.

How pathetic is it that we know it's a possibility?

[pchall]

http://www.mortonsalt.com/images/products/IodizedPlain_Salt.jpg


^^^^ Good comment, that!

Listen to Kalkhoven being nice and politic about the IRL and merger at the end of that quote above:

"There are two series now that are doing OK and, of course, I'm particularly proud of ours. To throw that away in pursuit of a merger would be a terrible mistake."

The IRL is in a bigger mess right now than the CART version of Champ Car was heading towards the 2003 season. Whatever happens cannot be done on terms that bails out the IRL, but only in a manner that adds to what Champ Car has been creating for itself.

[Rogue Leader]

I am pretty sure any merger would be a lot more ChampCar looking and a lot less IRL looking.

I could see the "IndayCar Series" name returning, but most likely the Panoz/Cosworth will be the final setup and I'd also bet a lot more CCWS venues would survive.

I cant see the team owners bitching out here, they all want to be at Indy and thats what is going to happen in the end....

[Spicoli]

http://i2.tinypic.com/tag9s5.jpg

Yep, I see no salt anywhere Bruce. :shakehead

good for the sport! Good for the FANS! :D

[Skater_36]

I am pretty sure any merger would be a lot more ChampCar looking and a lot less IRL looking.

I could see the "IndayCar Series" name returning, but most likely the Panoz/Cosworth will be the final setup and I'd also bet a lot more CCWS venues would survive.

I cant see the team owners bitching out here, they all want to be at Indy and thats what is going to happen in the end....


I'm wondering how Honda will figure in to the equation. Will there be a frozen engine spec with a common engine management control or will Honda just shake hands and part company? From public comments it would seem Honda would like to be involved but they may see this as an out to pursue other interests.

It would be nice to have a couple of different engines as long as development costs don't skyrocket.

[sundaydriver2]

You can bet that if Fonda is pushing for unification, they want to be a part of it.

I personally don't want to see them back in a series I watch. If it does happen, I'll be rooting for the Cosworth teams.

[gjc2]

I am pretty sure any merger would be a lot more ChampCar looking and a lot less IRL looking.

I sure hope so.

The "new" series should be the Champ Car World Series, by whatever name, with the addition of the Indianapolis 500. What other IRL venues are worth keeping?

George

[racer2c]

I just want Spicoli's race back. :)

[Spicoli]

I just want Spicoli's race back. :)

Thanks man. sucks to have that race in your backyard and have the Enemy runnin it.

All my race are belong to me. :gomer:

[dando]

Jeepers, question is if this thing really happens, who we gonna hate on? :gomer:

-Kevin

[formulaben]

Rahole and Fernandez will not be forgiven for a long, long time...

[Stu]

Jeepers, question is if this thing really happens, who we gonna hate on? :gomer:

-Kevin

I'm sure the Cleveland Browns will continue to provide you with plenty of amunition. :)

Plus there is always NASCAR. Oh and if the merger lives up to its hype, and F1 continues to get worse with all the politics...

[Spicoli]

Jeepers, question is if this thing really happens, who we gonna hate on? :gomer:

-Kevin

Rahole, Ganassh-ole, and I hope to (sic)god Cheeber. :gomer:

[Cam]

Rahole, Ganassh-ole, and I hope to (sic)god Cheeber. :gomer:

No Toekneebucks post merger. Cheeber full time Grand Sham...... :gomer:

[pchall]

Jeepers, question is if this thing really happens, who we gonna hate on? :gomer:

-Kevin

NASCAR and Grand Am seem to be prime candidates. ;)

[Hard Driver]

Let's not worry about who killed who.

Open wheel racing is better with one top series. (which it already has in Champcars) However, having the Indy 500, St. Pete and less competition to divide whatever sponsorship is out there, and the Indy 500 to sell is still worth a lot strictly from a Champcar standpoint. The whole would be better.

I just want to make sure that Tony's power is limited, so he can't screw it up. Maybe they placate him and save face by using the Indycar name, but he should be a big player with the Indy 500. And face it, having a merged series is going to do nothing but help the Indy 500.

But as far as teams, I wouldn't mind having the defectors back to the champ car ranks. But I hope they don't push out any.

[harryp]

Rahole, Ganassh-ole, and I hope to (sic)god Cheeber. :gomer:

What about Penske and Heeeeeeelio?

[Spicoli]

What about Penske and Heeeeeeelio?

You know, Cappy Liverspots is what he is. always was/is Indy-centric, self made guy, and really never lied about packing up and heading to EARL. Guys klike Fernandeth and rahole consciously threw daggers trying to kill CART. Gan******* is just a fat ego centric blowhard (who knows how to win, albeit lying and coniving the whole way), but uncle Roger calls a spade a spade.

I welcome him and Gaylio back. As long as PT gets one more season in ;)

[Stu]

Open wheel racing is better with one top series. (which it already has in Champcars) However, having the Indy 500, St. Pete and less competition to divide whatever sponsorship is out there, and the Indy 500 to sell is still worth a lot strictly from a Champcar standpoint. The whole would be better.

Let's also add the TV deal that IRL has with ESPN/ABC. While their announcers can be dreadful, it is certainly better than having to purchase time on different networks each week. Maybe some of the Champ Car guys could be hired by ABC to do some of the commentating. I am assuming they are Champ Car employees or contractors.

Oh and the IRL has a radio deal with XM as well.

[racer2c]

Let's also add the TV deal that IRL has with ESPN/ABC. While their announcers can be dreadful, it is certainly better than having to purchase time on different networks each week. Maybe some of the Champ Car guys could be hired by ABC to do some of the commentating. I am assuming they are Champ Car employees or contractors.

Oh and the IRL has a radio deal with XM as well.

Didn't I read earlier this year that the IRL was paying for all race time except Indy?

[Spicoli]

Didn't I read earlier this year that the IRL was paying for all race time except Indy?


Axe defender, it was all I lie (well, some goofy journailst had his facts wrong, imagine that)

no, they get paid and we time buy.

[Andrew Longman]

Axe defender, it was all I lie (well, some goofy journailst had his facts wrong, imagine that)

no, they get paid and we time buy.

Sort of. The journalist was shocked by the storm he kicked up and backed off his poorly researched claim.

The fact is that if ABC wants the I500 then they have to take the IRL too. That's Tony's deal. In the whacky world of pricing broadcast rights it is hard to decipher the rational buyers and sellers use, but given the ratings it is reasonable to say that if they had a choice, ABC would not be paying less if they were to broadcast just the 500. You might even argue they would pay more since they also have to pay the production costs of those other IRL races.

[dando]

IMHO, with ABC getting Cabs back, I wouldn't bet on them holding onto the EARL rights once this deal is up. Especially if the Fonda bucks dry up.

-Kevin

[Racing Truth]

IMHO, with ABC getting Cabs back, I wouldn't bet on them holding onto the EARL rights once this deal is up. Especially if the Fonda bucks dry up.

-Kevin

Well, seeing as they've had it for 40+ yrs. now, my guess is the Mouse will want the 500 still. Beyond that, problematic, but they can alternate broadcasts between ABC and ESPN.

[dando]

Well, seeing as they've had it for 40+ yrs. now, my guess is the Mouse will want the 500 still.
Same could have been said for MNF. :( Albiet the $$$ are significantly different between those, but the MNF ratings were significantly higher than one race @ 5-6 and a dozen others @ .1.

-Kevin

[Spicoli]

So, when will the :gomer: 500 be on ESPN?

(Someone go axe the media insider :eek: )

[Stu]

Who knows what could happen if there is a merger after the IRL rights deal is up.??? NBC could be looking to get some less expensive racing coverage since neckar left.

A merger should create a decent enough ratings jump to get some of the major networks to take a look at it.

[oddlycalm]

The vibe I get is that IFFFFF this goes down, Tony and Kevin are on the same page here. The only thing to potentially worry about is the other owners getting all pi$$y and '79 repeats itself. Good point, and not just pissy emotions to deal with either. If the teams can't get any sponsor interest in a unified series all bets are off. Fans on both sides of the split assume that sponsors will come running back with sacks of money once unification is formally announced, but I'm reasonably certain that won't happen. Then what...? Are TG, KK and GF going to want to continue to subsidize teams, and for how long?

To further complicate things, after LB we now know that Honda going LMP2 racing is a very real possibility and taking some teams along with them. Everybody assumed the EARL guys were at LB to talk about unification, but it was actually to talk with Panoz and Honda about ALMS.

oc

[Racing Truth]

Good point, and not just pissy emotions to deal with either. If the teams can't get any sponsor interest in a unified series all bets are off. Fans on both sides of the split assume that sponsors will come running back with sacks of money once unification is formally announced, but I'm reasonably certain that won't happen. Then what...? Are TG, KK and GF going to want to continue to subsidize teams, and for how long?

To further complicate things, after LB we now know that Honda going LMP2 racing is a very real possibility and taking some teams along with them. Everybody assumed the EARL guys were at LB to talk about unification, but it was actually to talk with Panoz and Honda about ALMS.

oc

Right, but I wouldn't assume that, should a merger occur, the above-mentioned teams will just go ALMS-exclusive.

As for the 1st part, true, but if so, the owners will be in no spot to split the sport again

[SID]

While we're at it, can we get Helio's face taken off and Paul's put on to the Borg Warner for his Indy win?

Thanks in advance,

SID

[Cam]

While we're at it, can we get Helio's face taken off and Paul's put on to the Borg Warner for his Indy win?

Thanks in advance,

SID
WOW! :saywhat: :eek:

[rabbit]

From Eric Gagnon's blog (http://overheardatthetrack.blogspot.com/):

oh boy. I've got about a minute and a half to write before I am off to explore Denver. But let me tell you, the piece of news I recieved yesterday is shocking. Well, I guess its not shocking, but its BIG! here's the problem: as a trustworthy employee of champcar (yes, just freelance, but nonetheless trustworthy), I don't think I can tell you guys what it is. I don't want to get in more trouble than I usually get myself into. I am torn, but must do the right thing. But, let me just say this: you heard it from me. and I like to think I have pretty good connections within this racing world. I am not some two-bit reporter who throws crap on the wall and sees what sticks. I think we all know what 'topic' this revolves around, as there is basically just one topic that makes open-wheel racing in america go round. this is big....Know whatahmean, know whatahmean, nudge nudge, know whatahmean, say no more...

[racer2c]

From Eric Gagnon's blog (http://overheardatthetrack.blogspot.com/):
Know whatahmean, know whatahmean, nudge nudge, know whatahmean, say no more...

Danicle was at LB! Where are the pics! :gomer:

[Ankf00]

On a somewhat related note, F*** ESPN.

[rabbit]

On a somewhat related note, F*** ESPN.
:confused: Care to elaborate? (I think I missed something.)

[racer2c]

:confused: Care to elaborate? (I think I missed something.)

let me guess, ESPN's coverage of the LBGP was nothing more than a 10 second spot with Danickle sitting in someones pits.

[racer2c]

From Eric Gagnon's blog (http://overheardatthetrack.blogspot.com/):
Know whatahmean, know whatahmean, nudge nudge, know whatahmean, say no more...


So I wonder what the big news would be over and beyond the news of a merger itself? Red Bull as a commited title sponsor?

[Ankf00]

:confused: Care to elaborate? (I think I missed something.)
no you didn't, it was only somewhat related. :) But true none the less.

[NismoZ]

What? I put the sock tethers away after the Cosworth announcement, couldn't even find 'em before the Mazda thing, NOW what am I supposed to do? Dammit, big GOOD or big BAD!?

[sundaydriver2]

How many people here believe that FTG will have to dragged kicking and screaming to the merger table??

[cart7]

I think we all know what 'topic' this revolves around, as there is basically just one topic that makes open-wheel racing in america go round. this is big..

The Hulmans are selling the speedway to KK.

[racer2c]

The Hulmans are selling the speedway to KK.


:eek: Now THAT would be big enough to knock my socks off. Holy Cow. Could you imagine?

That would be something the Frances would balk at for sure.

[rabbit]

The Hulmans are selling the speedway to KK.A similar scenario is being discussed on CW, only it involves KK buying the IRL and leaving the track and the race to the Hulmans. This would be one way to accomplish a "merger" and save face for TG at the same time.

[Spicoli]

How many people here believe that FTG will have to dragged kicking and screaming to the merger table??

He's f&&&d it up many times before at the last minute. I would not trust him until 2 years after the merger was announced.

[trauma1]

The Hulmans are selling the speedway to KK.
best thing that could happen in racing geting rid of mari the corpse that just will not die :rofl:

[cameraman]

The Hulmans are selling the speedway to KK.

Best thing about that would be watching the heads explode.

I have come to absolutely despise a number of denizens of the internet and that would absolutely kill them.

If that were even slightly possible....

[nrc]

Here's what I would call "big". Three or four IRL teams commit to running a car at select Champ car events for the rest of the year. Three or four Champ car teams run Indy and maybe one or two other IRL events.

Rahal already has his shirt.
http://i2.tinypic.com/tag9s5.jpg

[oddlycalm]

Best thing about that would be watching the heads explode.

I have come to absolutely despise a number of denizens of the internet and that would absolutely kill them.

If that were even slightly possible.... I agree, it would be quite satisfying to watch the meltdown. I nearly got laughed off of 7G for suggesting CART should use the proceeds from going public to buy the IMS the better part of a decade ago, but it was the best plan then and still is. Get rid of the wankers and put the entire business on a solid footing once again.

oc

[Spicoli]

I agree, it would be quite satisfying to watch the meltdown. I nearly got laughed off of 7G for suggesting CART should use the proceeds from going public to buy the IMS the better part of a decade ago, but it was the best plan then and still is. Get rid of the wankers and put the entire business on a solid footing once again.

oc

it's not FTG's to sell.

Kyle the inheritor is next up ta bat.

[cameraman]

it's not FTG's to sell.

Which may well increase its chances of being sold...
Assuming the rest of the family would just as soon have a big pile o' cash.


All of which begs the question - If things have progressed to the point where freelance track announcers are informed about "it", when do us common folk find out?

[TKGAngel]

Which may well increase its chances of being sold...
Assuming the rest of the family would just as soon have a big pile o' cash.


All of which begs the question - If things have progressed to the point where freelance track announcers are informed about "it", when do us common folk find out?

When Robin Miller tells us; or when your internet connection slows down due to the goo created from exploding heads at other internet forums.

[Racing Truth]

When Robin Miller tells us; or when your internet connection slows down due to the goo created from exploding heads at other internet forums.

:laugh: :laugh:

Or, my guess, sometime in May, perhaps during the 500 broadcast.

[Racing Truth]

From Eric Gagnon's blog (http://overheardatthetrack.blogspot.com/):
Know whatahmean, know whatahmean, nudge nudge, know whatahmean, say no more...

On an unrelated note, dude (Gagnon), just because you have a blog doesn't mean you can taunt us.

"I know something about something but can't tell you." :gomer:

Yeah, thanks for that. :rolleyes:

[devilmaster]

Gagnon, if you can't say your little secret, don't bother going 'I've got a secret but I can't say'

I think yer a little older than 6 dude.

Totally pointless blog entry, imho.

[Racing Truth]

Gagnon, if you can't say your little secret, don't bother going 'I've got a secret but I can't say'

I think yer a little older than 6 dude.

Totally pointless blog entry, imho.

Thank you. :thumbup:

[Racing Truth]

^^ I see dmaster wrote the same on Gagnon's blog too. :thumbup:

[devilmaster]

^^ I see dmaster wrote the same on Gagnon's blog too. :thumbup:

Yep. Because mostly he's contradicting himself. 'I'm a trusted employee but there is a secret I know!'

Not really trustworthy then are ya? :rolleyes:

[cameraman]

Unless his job is to stir the pot....

[dando]

Rahal already has his shirt.

Yeah. WTF is up with that? :saywhat:

-Kevin

[Spicoli]

Yeah. WTF is up with that? :saywhat:

-Kevin

What, you really wanna see Bobbo the Rat without a shirt? :saywhat:

[FTG]

I always said that when the family got tired of Tony's money-losing stupidity they would sell. I always thought ISC would buy, because the track is worth more with a NASCAR race and only the Frances can guarantee a NASCAR race. I always thought it would happen after Mari died.

I suppose, however, that the family might be willing to accept less money and sell half to KK& GF as long as they let Mari keep saying "gentlemen start your engines."

It would also explain why KK wanted to keep it so quiet. He's afraid of NASCAR. It would also explain why KK said someone was trying to stop the deal: NASCAR.

Makes sense, but Indy is Spicoli's backyard. No way he'd let the biggest story since 95 slip under his nose. Plus,,,,,,,,,, the guy who posted it,,,,,,, is the guy who everyone laughs at here,,,,,,, so it's got to be a bunch of BS.

[TKGAngel]

What, you really wanna see Bobbo the Rat without a shirt? :saywhat:

For the love of god, no!

[devilmaster]

For the love of god, no!

Exactly. Just ask Danica, I'm sure she's probably seen it.... ;)

[Spicoli]

For the love of god, no!

OK.

http://www.ballbellybear.com/ballbellybears/ballbellybearfiles/BearFairie/9-14-03/hairy%20chest.jpg

:D

[cameraman]

Tell me that you don't have ballbellybear bookmarked.....

[FCYTravis]

And you know that picture is from that specific Web site how exactly?

:rofl: :gomer: :saywhat:

[cameraman]

Hit the quote reply link.

It shows you the URL of the picture.

I editted out the rest of the img link because I couldn't stand to see it repeated.

[Spicoli]

Tell me that you don't have ballbellybear bookmarked.....

I just googles hairy chest rahole.

[Ankf00]

I just googles hairy chest rahole.
translation: took a quick snapshot in the mirror then uploaded it for public consumption.

[oddlycalm]

I just googles hairy chest rahole. Thanks for the bad memories...

We were on our way to New Awluns for the world fair on our hawgs and the hotel we stopped at outside Dallas had a sign out front that said "Welcome Bears." After 700mi of hot riding that message didn't quite click with us so imagine our surprise when we strolled into the hotel bar in our riding clothes and were welcomed with great enthusiasm... :eek: We did a quick reverse course but as we were leaving they were announcing nominations for sumthin that sounded like the congeniality award.... :D

oc

[dando]

What, you really wanna see Bobbo the Rat without a shirt? :saywhat:
No. My preference is Ganasty:

http://www.gabbyattic.com/truepix/fat%20bastard.jpg

:gomer:

Of course my point is why does he have a CCWS shirt with the team logo on it? :saywhat:

-Kevin

[devilmaster]

Of course my point is why does he have a CCWS shirt with the team logo on it? :saywhat:

-Kevin

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=208407&FS=IRL

[dando]

http://www.motorsport.com/news/article.asp?ID=208407&FS=IRL
Right. I get dat shizzle. Question is why is it a Rawhore Letterman CCWS logo shirt, and not one of these:

http://www.champcaratlantic.com/images/header/logo_06.gif

Watching all that bad baseball has rusted them synapses, Stevie. :p

-Kevin

[Cam]

Right. I get dat shizzle. Question is why is it a Rawhore Letterman CCWS logo shirt, and not one of these:
-Kevin

Just one more dagger into the heart of the earl....... I will take it. One of these days the inheriitor will have to relinquish the keys...... It's playing out right in front of you now..... FACTS dont lie and a lot of what you are seeing is fact! Owners championing other series etc...... Watch...... This will be a lot of fun! ;)

[devilmaster]

Right. I get dat shizzle. Question is why is it a Rawhore Letterman CCWS logo shirt, and not one of these:

http://www.champcaratlantic.com/images/header/logo_06.gif

Watching all that bad baseball has rusted them synapses, Stevie. :p

-Kevin

Since he is there for his kid, one should assume that its Conquest's or Gehl's decision on the shirt (more likely gehl cause he also has a gehl lanyard) , and since the Atlantic logo is new, perhaps they were just using up shirts they already had.

[dando]

Since he is there for his kid, one should assume that its Conquest's or Gehl's decision on the shirt (more likely gehl cause he also has a gehl lanyard) , and since the Atlantic logo is new, perhaps they were just using up shirts they already had.
I guess. Seems misleading. I'd rather not have that ******* representin', yo. :shakehead :saywhat:

Peace, yo. :cool:

-Kevin

[dando]

Just one more dagger into the heart of the earl....... I will take it. One of these days the inheriitor will have to relinquish the keys...... It's playing out right in front of you now..... FACTS dont lie and a lot of what you are seeing is fact! Owners championing other series etc...... Watch...... This will be a lot of fun! ;)
Yeah, but Benedict Rahole? :mad:

No worries. I have a comfy chair pulled up to watch the fire. Marshmallow anyone? :D

-Kevin

[Cam]

Yeah, but Benedict Rahole? :mad:

No worries. I have a comfy chair pulled up to watch the fire. Matshmallow anyone? :D

-Kevin

PS...... Whindrediti and Fernandez etc are following suit too..... the rats bailing a second time.

News Flash!!!!!! Tony Lied to them! And now they are realizing it!

Just to add..... It will be an equal hate society...... :D

[Insomniac]

Which may well increase its chances of being sold...
Assuming the rest of the family would just as soon have a big pile o' cash.


All of which begs the question - If things have progressed to the point where freelance track announcers are informed about "it", when do us common folk find out?

If Indy was for sale, I don't see any scenario except the France's as the new owners.

[devilmaster]

News Flash!!!!!! Tony Lied to them! And now they are realizing it!

They knew it all along, they were just happy getting money under the table... and **** loyalty.

[dando]

PS...... Whindrediti and Fernandez etc are following suit too..... the rats bailing a second time.

News Flash!!!!!! Tony Lied to them! And now they are realizing it!

Just to add..... It will be an equal hate society...... :D
Like Steve said, Fernandeth and Rahole were willing accomplices to do the evil Lord Sagamore's bidding. AGR just sold out pure and simple. The only good that can some of this will be the return of some true anymosity/conflict to a combined series. Somewhat like is was when FRP was dominating and then Ganasty. Outside of the occassional PT vs. Frogger, there just isn't an interesting conflict in CCWS.

-Kevin