San Marino

[Hard Driver]

Great Race. Well for F1 at least.

Sure it was a battle for the lead. But I have to admit that Alonso was a second a lap faster than Schumacher and spent half the race stuck behind him. So I guess that is exciting, but it would be more exciting if there was actually racing for the lead that included a pass. God forbid, even a pass and a re-pass.

Alonso also lost his advantage with the early pit stop. If he was patient, Schumacher would have had to stop first, I think the announcers said. This would have given Alonso a few laps on lighter fuel to get a pass done in the pits. I think Renault blew it on the change of pit strategy.

However, I do think it is kinda sad that one of the most exciting parts of the race was a non pass in the pits, or a backmarker punting another backmarker.

[pchall]

Such is the racing in modern F1. The Renault decision to abandon their pit strategy was odd, especially since what the announcers were saying indicated that staying out until Schumacher pitted might have worked. But then it might not have worked and they would have been stuck behind the Ferrari anyhow. I was disappointed to see it turn into a blocking event just like last year.

Maybe F1 should go back to no refueling and make them work all race long? Or radically cut the number of guys allowed over the wall and ditch the pressurized rig...

[Spicoli]

Sheheen needs to stfu and quit reminding us of stupid stuff like:

"The yougest driver EVER to win a championship in GP history". i figgered it out the FOURTH time you said inside of 5 minutes.

chill out.

[Dirty Sanchez]

Symonds: We still would have finished second.
Mon 24 Apr, 12:40 PM


Pat Symonds has insisted that Fernando Alonso would still have finished in second place had he kept to the planned strategy for his second stop.

With Michael Schumacher struggling greatly with tyre degredation during the second stint of the race, allowing Alonso to home in on the seven-time world champion in just ten laps, it was thought that the Spaniard would merely vault him when he came in for his second stop, particularly as he was expected to run several laps longer.

However, this was not the case according to Symonds, who claimed that Alonso had been short fuelled at his first pit stop to get ahead of Jenson Button and Felipe Massa, meaning he had a maximum of just one more lap than Schumacher, a lap that was not thought to have been enough to get him ahead.

"Things became very surprising (in the middle stint). Michael's tyre degradation was suddenly dreadful - and it very soon became clear that we were significantly quicker than him, and running much faster. It took Fernando less than ten laps to close the gap and start pressuring him."

Instead, Symonds called Alonso in a lap early to try and get the jump on Schumacher. Ferrari duly responded by bringing Schumacher in immediately after, the German crucially managing to set a 1min 25.7 second in-lap, compared to the 1min 27.4 second laps he had been doing previously.

"The really significant thing was that on the free lap after Fernando pitted, Michael showed he had some performance in reserve. On the lap we pitted, he did a lap of 1:25.7 - where his average speed in the ten previous laps, was 1:27.4. The lap-times during the second stint had not suggested he had that performance in reserve."

As a result, Schumacher was able to stay ahead of Alonso to the chequered flag and take a famous victory at their home circuit. However, Symonds denies that he made a tactical faux-pas, saying that second place would have been inevitable anyway had they not taken a chance.

"Fernando pitted two laps earlier than we had planned. Had we been certain of going significantly further than Michael in the second stint then obviously, the option would have been to stay out - and it would have probably worked. But we didn't have that extra fuel, and we would probably have run only a lap longer than Michael.

"During that lap, he would have been on new tyres and we saw in qualifying that they were particularly strong on those opening 'golden' laps. So we didn't think it would work for us and obviously, simply following Michael in and out of the pits was not an option. So we got creative, and took the only other option available to try and get the win - to bring Fernando in earlyÂ…"

Indeed, Symonds was far from disappointed with the result and took the time to praise Ferrari, who produced speed in the crucial stages of the race to end Renault's three-race winning streak.

"I think that's what motor racing is all about to be honest," he added. "Hats off to Michael and Ferrari, because they pulled a blinder! From our point of view, we could have run our planned strategy and still finished second. But it would have been an unsatisfying second place, because there would have been a 'what if' factor because we hadn't explored every option available to us.

"As it was, we tried everything we could - and it didn't come off because we saw two cars with very equal levels of performance, battling for the win. As I said yesterday, "nothing ventured, nothing gained." But in this case, nothing lost either."

[Easy]

Things I learned from the CBS broadcast:

-Fernando Alonso is the youngest world champ ever.
-He is so famous in Spain that he had to move to England so he could urinate.
-Fernando Alonso is the youngest world champion ever at 24.
-Hold on to your holllyhocks, Alonso is about to smoke his front tires and not make a challenge. Which apparently is good stoof.
-Fernando Alonso is the youngest man ever to win a world drivers championship.
-Felipe Massa had the highest trap speed at 183mph.
-The Tifosi are the Ferrari faithful.
-Fernando Alonso is the youngest world champion ever.
-Felipe Massa set the highest trap speed at 183mph.
-Nico Rosberg is the son of Derek Daly's teammate at Williams.(Translation: I used to be an F1 driver)
-Fernando Alonso, who last year became the youngest f1 champ ever is about mount a challenge to Schumacher.

I understand that they are trying to fill in the uneducated audience they hoped would watch but Varsha and Matchett would have been 10x more informative to that audience. All the uninformed now know (if they didn't change the channel) is that Alonso is apparently a child genius and not seeing a pass for the lead is good stuff.

[Spicoli]

^^^well said ^^^ :thumbup:

[Insomniac]

Things I learned from the CBS broadcast:

-Fernando Alonso is the youngest world champ ever.
-He is so famous in Spain that he had to move to England so he could urinate.
-Fernando Alonso is the youngest world champion ever at 24.
-Hold on to your holllyhocks, Alonso is about to smoke his front tires and not make a challenge. Which apparently is good stoof.
-Fernando Alonso is the youngest man ever to win a world drivers championship.
-Felipe Massa had the highest trap speed at 183mph.
-The Tifosi are the Ferrari faithful.
-Fernando Alonso is the youngest world champion ever.
-Felipe Massa set the highest trap speed at 183mph.
-Nico Rosberg is the son of Derek Daly's teammate at Williams.(Translation: I used to be an F1 driver)
-Fernando Alonso, who last year became the youngest f1 champ ever is about mount a challenge to Schumacher.

I understand that they are trying to fill in the uneducated audience they hoped would watch but Varsha and Matchett would have been 10x more informative to that audience. All the uninformed now know (if they didn't change the channel) is that Alonso is apparently a child genius and not seeing a pass for the lead is good stuff.

And they're also probably wondering why this prodigy couldn't pass the 37 year old Schumacher.

[Cam]

And they're also probably wondering why this prodigy couldn't pass the 37 year old Schumacher.

Oh, come on...... That's obvious..... It's because of the brutal and boring circuit! :p

[oddlycalm]

Things I learned from the CBS broadcast... :D :thumbup:

[oddlycalm]

Last year Alonso was able to slow down to avoid catching traffic and Chin wasn't able to get by. Same thing in reverse this year. Bottom line is that it takes more than a 2 second per lap difference to pass at Imola. Can't blame Alonso for not wanting to risk a guaranteed 8 pts, but it made for a bit of a limp race.

oc

[RacinM3]

I thought it was a good race. Why was it a limp race? Only because Alonso couldn't pull off the pass? Sometimes you're the bug, sometimes the windshield. Yesterday, Alonso was the bug!

I too was annoyed at the announcers. At one point while Alonso was really pressuring Schumacher under braking then at turn-in, he picked up a big understeer and went way wide. The announcers screamed "OH, ALONSO MADE A MISTAKE" when it was plainly obvious he'd lost the air to his front wing in Schumacher's wake, in his attempt to get by.

[indyfan31]

I too was annoyed at the announcers. At one point while Alonso was really pressuring Schumacher under braking then at turn-in, he picked up a big understeer and went way wide. The announcers screamed "OH, ALONSO MADE A MISTAKE" when it was plainly obvious he'd lost the air to his front wing in Schumacher's wake, in his attempt to get by.
If you know that's going to happen, and you do it anyway, isn't it still a mistake?

[RichK]

If you know that's going to happen, and you do it anyway, isn't it still a mistake?

Not if you are trying everything you can to get by. If nothing else is working....give it a shot.

[indyfan31]

Not if you are trying everything you can to get by. If nothing else is working....give it a shot.
Of course you give it a shot, but if your attempt doesn't work and you fall farther back, it was still a mistake. I realize it's just semantics but there is nothing wrong with calling it what it is.
And don't even think of accusing me of defending the announcers, there were truly awful, but I you're gonna pick them apart you need a better argument.

[RacinM3]

Actually, my argument would be that it wasn't the fastest corner on the track (thus minimizing downforce loss to turbulence), and Alonso probably figured "what the hell, give it a try", since he was at his closest point to Schumacher. Add to that the fact that Alonso was surely calculating his odds at the other places around the track where a pass could be made, and decided that to be the best spot for a go. He goes in, the air's too dirty, it doesn't work. Not every missed passing attempt is necessarily a mistake. Had Schumacher locked up going into that corner, allowing Alonso by, now THAT would have been a mistake.

Aside from that, my issue with the announcers is the knee-jerk "he made a mistake" exclamation, rather than the more analytical approach you get with, say, Steve Matchett, who I'm sure would have said something more along the lines of "Alonso goes for the pass, loses front downforce, and can't pull it off". It is semantics, but one of them surely is more analytical and educational.

[TrueBrit]

Alonso was looking to make a lunge and had to back off due to the local yellow...he did a remarkable job not chucking it into the kitty litter all things considered, but it gave Daly a chance to yap inanely about something else for a while...This, of course, was preceded by BOTH commentators wetting their collective knickers when the yellow initially came out...as if it were a f/c yellow....mucking forons.... :shakehead

[Hard Driver]

WTF was that yellow for?

[cameraman]

David Coulthard broke a drive shaft and was very slow on the track and/or momentairly stopped on the track.

[oddlycalm]

I thought it was a good race. Why was it a limp race? Only because Alonso couldn't pull off the pass? The announcers probably contributed more to any frustration I felt about the race than anything. I don't consider it a positive that there is simply no way one F1 car can get around another that is 2+ seconds a lap slower at Imola, but that's with a lot of tracks.

I did think it was quite clever for Chin to hold Alonso behind him and run 27's and when Alonso (predictably) gets frustrated and pits he then cracks off a 25.

oc

[indyfan31]

Actually, my argument would be that it wasn't the fastest corner on the track (thus minimizing downforce loss to turbulence), and Alonso probably figured "what the hell, give it a try", since he was at his closest point to Schumacher. Add to that the fact that Alonso was surely calculating his odds at the other places around the track where a pass could be made, and decided that to be the best spot for a go. He goes in, the air's too dirty, it doesn't work. Not every missed passing attempt is necessarily a mistake. Had Schumacher locked up going into that corner, allowing Alonso by, now THAT would have been a mistake.

Aside from that, my issue with the announcers is the knee-jerk "he made a mistake" exclamation, rather than the more analytical approach you get with, say, Steve Matchett, who I'm sure would have said something more along the lines of "Alonso goes for the pass, loses front downforce, and can't pull it off". It is semantics, but one of them surely is more analytical and educational.
Good points, both of them. :thumbup:

[cameraman]

Alonso was screwed when they short filled him to get him out ahead of Button. Renault is saying they only brought him in 1 lap early in that second stint. Nobody but the team knew that at the time.

The feed was lame and the announcing team sure didn't help any.

It will be interesting to see what they do to the track, sounds like next year will be a completely new race.

Watching cars orbiting at a low engineered speed that will ensure that they hold position while getting x.x mpg does make for a rather limp race.

[Cam]

Watching the Speed replay that is on right now, I can now really tell how bad the broadcast last weekend was! Varsha, Hobbo and Matchett are absolutely the best commentary combo there is. :thumbup:

[cameraman]

Night and day difference.

3 more on CBS :shakehead

[oddlycalm]

Aside from that, my issue with the announcers is the knee-jerk "he made a mistake" exclamation, rather than the more analytical approach you get with, say, Steve Matchett, who I'm sure would have said something more along the lines of "Alonso goes for the pass, loses front downforce, and can't pull it off". It is semantics, but one of them surely is more analytical and educational. You called that one nearly to the letter Scott. I saw enough of the SPEED broadcast to confirm that nobody blurted out "he made a mistake" when Alonso's front end washed out from Chin's wake. :laugh:

oc