Hero to Zero...almost?

[NismoZ]

Geez, the guy wins two straight, hires an agent then almost gets shelved for Toronto!? Gerald must drive a hard bargain. RM says AJ signed only for the rest of '06 instead of through '08 so race victories bring clout, too. Think Haas will try to snap him up to replace a sagging Bruno? PT must be relieved, though :D

[Insomniac]

Geez, the guy wins two straight, hires an agent then almost gets shelved for Toronto!? Gerald must drive a hard bargain. RM says AJ signed only for the rest of '06 instead of through '08 so race victories bring clout, too. Think Haas will try to snap him up to replace a sagging Bruno? PT must be relieved, though :D

:confused:

How did he almost get shelved for Toronto?

[grungex]

Geez, the guy wins two straight, hires an agent then almost gets shelved for Toronto!? Gerald must drive a hard bargain. RM says AJ signed only for the rest of '06 instead of through '08 so race victories bring clout, too. Think Haas will try to snap him up to replace a sagging Bruno? PT must be relieved, though :D
What are you talking about? Jerry offered him a contract through 2008, how is that "almost shelved"? AJ was the one that wanted to hedge his bets, and there's no way he was going to be allowed in the car without any contract at all.

[NismoZ]

He was OFFERED a contract through '08 but his new agent said no thanks. Gerry got pissed and said since there was no contract then maybe AJ had no ride! Robin says "cooler heads prevailed", which I think means GF wanted to win another race and accepted a contract through '06 only. To me it appears, if all true, that Gerry was gambling that AJ would jump at the offer of 2.5 yrs. of security but the new agent believed his client's stock had risen to the point where AJ is quite literally in the drivers seat. I'd almost forgotten what that was like in CC. I only made the Haas comment because I think that is exactly what the agent is thinking...we'll win the title for Forsythe then shop around for a REALLY good offer! That make more sense now? (If true :) ) "...he damn near went from unemployed to hero to back watching races." ...RM, SPEED News, Sat. night.

[grungex]

But are you suggesting that GF should have let him back in the car with no contract at all?

[NismoZ]

No, my clear suggestion is that Forsythe wanted AJ through '06 rather than not at all. :) If he wants to keep him, he'll have to come up with a better offer, don't you think? Will he be able to afford the two top paid (I'll assume) drivers in the series, or will AJ's new fame and success generate some sponsorship? Hope so.

[L1P1]

Haey, N/H could give the boot to Bruno and hire AJ, then GF could go get Juan Pabl...,er, nevermind.

[toymaker]

Win a couple of races after getting on a great (or the right) team and then this...Must be tough to get the helmet over that inflated head! Glad he has an agent to ASSist him now. :rolleyes:

[Insomniac]

Win a couple of races after getting on a great (or the right) team and then this...Must be tough to get the helmet over that inflated head! Glad he has an agent to ASSist him now. :rolleyes:

Ohhh come on. He wants to get paid what he feels he deserves. The real problem appears to just be the agent not being familiar with GF. RM makes it seem like he tried to tell GF how it would be instead of negotiating. Seems like GF will do his best to retain AJ beyond 2006, but we'll see how it works out.

[NismoZ]

GF quoted as saying "No agent is going to tell me what to do. He (agent) doesn't know me. I take care of my drivers."

[cameraman]

So did Paul Tracy use an agent to get his 5 year deal?

If he did then I don't see where Forsythe has grounds to bitch.

[Insomniac]

So did Paul Tracy use an agent to get his 5 year deal?

If he did then I don't see where Forsythe has grounds to bitch.

Like I said, it may have just been the nature by which the agent spoke to him, not that he dislikes all agents.

[toymaker]

Forsythe said he sat down with Paul personally and hammered it out.

[NismoZ]

Exactly so. No agent. He said he'd sit down with AJ and do the same thing. No mention of the agent being present! :D Sounds to me like GF thinks it's OK for AJ to have an agent but that doesn't mean he has to talk to him! Forsythe will "take care" of his new driver, of that I have no doubt, the only question is will someone out there take care of him BETTER!? Ah, the trials faced with new found success, combined with the uncertain future of open wheel racing. Maybe AJ foreshadowed his decision in victory lane by exclaiming "I love ChampCar! I love winning!" A nice compromise might be to sign 'til the end of '07 and see what transpires on the merger horizon. :)

[Dr. Corkski]

Big difference.

Forsythe knows that without an agent he can bully Dinger into a lowball contract. He couldn't do that with Tracy.

[Insomniac]

Big difference.

Forsythe knows that without an agent he can bully Dinger into a lowball contract. He couldn't do that with Tracy.

Please. You think Villeneuve doesn't have an agent? You think PT never had one? You think Greg Moore was unrepresented? Patrick Carpentier? Alex Tagliani? You can't look at anything relating to FCR objectively.

[Insomniac]

Exactly so. No agent. He said he'd sit down with AJ and do the same thing. No mention of the agent being present! :D Sounds to me like GF thinks it's OK for AJ to have an agent but that doesn't mean he has to talk to him! Forsythe will "take care" of his new driver, of that I have no doubt, the only question is will someone out there take care of him BETTER!? Ah, the trials faced with new found success, combined with the uncertain future of open wheel racing. Maybe AJ foreshadowed his decision in victory lane by exclaiming "I love ChampCar! I love winning!" A nice compromise might be to sign 'til the end of '07 and see what transpires on the merger horizon. :)

I think the agent wants to see what else is out there before committing to FCR. I think they'll work something out, we'll see how long. In my opinion, the 2007 season could be a different landscape given the new chassis. If you want the best chance to win, go where they spend money on developing the car. Doesn't leave many options.

[NismoZ]

No. Tracy was in a much weaker position punctuated by age and lack of success in moving elsewhere. His BEST option was in accepting a long term contract. Bullying had no part in that deal. Of course GF would like an extended contract with AJ but notice his offer was only half (in length) that offered to Tracy. GF is striking while the team is hot and we all know it. If I'm AJ I'd take the '08 deal but want the right to reopen or run at the end of '07. That way if he is a champ by then he's worth a LOT more! Now, if Ferrari comes calling... :D

[Dr. Corkski]

Please. You think Villeneuve doesn't have an agent? You think PT never had one? You think Greg Moore was unrepresented? Patrick Carpentier? Alex Tagliani? You can't look at anything relating to FCR objectively.Gesus Forsythe can do no wrong because he has a hard on for that Tracy guy too. :gomer:

All those other guys you mentioned were backed by Player's. Completely different situation.

Forsythe knows AJ needs the ride more than Forsythe needs him. It's pretty obvious Forsythe wants AJ for far below the market value he himself set for Tracy. Given AJ's inexperience in dealing with those matters, bypassing the agent is the easiest way to lowball AJ.

[grungex]

Well gosh, if you had told us before that you were sitting at the table with them during the negotiations we wouldn't have wasted all these here electrons on this thread. GMAFB. :thumdown:

[Easy]

Please. You think Villeneuve doesn't have an agent? You think PT never had one? You think Greg Moore was unrepresented? Patrick Carpentier? Alex Tagliani? You can't look at anything relating to FCR objectively.


I think you missed the point of Cork's post more than Michael Bay missed the point when he made, "Pearl Harbor".

[Dr. Corkski]

I think you missed the point of Cork's post more than Michael Bay missed the point when he made, "Pearl Harbor".That or he really thinks Forsythe is an idiot. :laugh:

[Sean O'Gorman]

Forsythe knows AJ needs the ride more than Forsythe needs him. It's pretty obvious Forsythe wants AJ for far below the market value he himself set for Tracy. Given AJ's inexperience in dealing with those matters, bypassing the agent is the easiest way to lowball AJ.

Forsythe the series owner needs AJ just as much as AJ needs a top ride.

[Insomniac]

Gesus Forsythe can do no wrong because he has a hard on for that Tracy guy too. :gomer:

All those other guys you mentioned were backed by Player's. Completely different situation.

Forsythe knows AJ needs the ride more than Forsythe needs him. It's pretty obvious Forsythe wants AJ for far below the market value he himself set for Tracy. Given AJ's inexperience in dealing with those matters, bypassing the agent is the easiest way to lowball AJ.

Ohh right, because Player's hired them and told GF he had to run them right? GF had absoluely nothing to do with anything I suppose.

I must've missed the part where any of the contract numbers were made public for you to have any idea of whether he low-balled AJ or not. It would be unheard for an agent to try and find out what his client's value is before signing the first contract offered. I mean, what kind of fool did AJ hire to not pounce on the first contract after winning his first two races with FCR.

Of course, you assume immediately that GF want to pay him peanuts with absolutely no justification for that. In fact, just looking at FCR you get the opposite picture. Almost no sponsorship besides his own comapnies since Player's left in 2003. He bought so much CART stock as the price kept going down and down. Purchased the seriers with KK. Owns 2 events in Mexico, 1 of which will be dropped even though he has the clout to keep it on the schedule. Bought the LBGP and Toronto with KK. Develops his cars. He sure throws around a lot of money, and now, your conclusion with no facts is he lowballed AJ and that's why he was mad about the agent. Excellent logic and great conclusions.

[Insomniac]

I think you missed the point of Cork's post more than Michael Bay missed the point when he made, "Pearl Harbor".

I don't think so. I read into his insinuation perfectly, and his response only confirms that. He thinks GF doesn't deal with agents so he can lowbasll his drivers. Only problem being, he's dealt with plenty of agents in the past.

[Insomniac]

That or he really thinks Forsythe is an idiot. :laugh:

Right, I think lowballing someone is genius. Of course GF wants to secure AJ for as little as possible, and AJ and his agent wants to be paid as much as possible. Hence the point of negotiating. Lowballing isn't a tactic you use to keep someone you want to keep around.

[Dr. Corkski]

I hope you are getting a hardcard for being a human shield when bullets aren't even being fired, to the point where you need to put words in my mouth to defend them. :rofl:

I am sure Forsythe's hard-on for Canada was the only reason he kept hiring Canadians when he had Player's plastered all over his cars. Nothing to do with some Canadian tobacco brand at all. :laugh:

All I have said is Forsythe doesn't want to deal with AJ's agent because he could easily lowball AJ if they "hammered" out a contract without the agent involved. AJ's inexperience and couple with his personality almost makes it too easy.

Unless you wiretapped the conversations between the agent and Forsythe, looks to me like you don't have idea what went on either. So everything here was speculation to being, now why exactly are you complaining about others speculating when you are doing the exact same thing?

We are talking about the same Forsythe that almost kicked a contracted driver to the curb for a wanker's Corona money, right?

[NismoZ]

And I guess RedBull NASCAB has been on the phone recently as well? If not, AJ's new agent better be! My guess is ol' Dietrich has more coin than Gerry. Tip o' the iceberg, folks!

[Insomniac]

I hope you are getting a hardcard for being a human shield when bullets aren't even being fired, to the point where you need to put words in my mouth to defend them. :rofl:

I am sure Forsythe's hard-on for Canada was the only reason he kept hiring Canadians when he had Player's plastered all over his cars. Nothing to do with some Canadian tobacco brand at all. :laugh:

All I have said is Forsythe doesn't want to deal with AJ's agent because he could easily lowball AJ if they "hammered" out a contract without the agent involved. AJ's inexperience and couple with his personality almost makes it too easy.

Unless you wiretapped the conversations between the agent and Forsythe, looks to me like you don't have idea what went on either. So everything here was speculation to being, now why exactly are you complaining about others speculating when you are doing the exact same thing?

We are talking about the same Forsythe that almost kicked a contracted driver to the curb for a wanker's Corona money, right?

Sorry for putting words in your mouth. It certainly isn't my intention. Calling GF "Gesus" doesn't really scream unbiased.

The reason I not complaining about speulating is when others speculate, they make it clear or quote some source. You just make statements like "Forsythe knows that without an agent he can bully Dinger into a lowball contract. He couldn't do that with Tracy." Without any idea of what was offered. Get some facts before you claim GF wants to or is lowballing AJ. It's just completey ridiculous to pull that out of the air. When has GF ever had a history of being chaep or lowballing drivers?

I never claimed to know anything about any conversation, but was referring to quotes attributed to GF.

Yes, the same GF who brought him back and paid for the ride the entire year. The same one who paid Tagliani's salary while he drove for Gentolozzi.

[Insomniac]

And I guess RedBull NASCAB has been on the phone recently as well? If not, AJ's new agent better be! My guess is ol' Dieter has more coin than Gerry. Tip o' the iceberg, folks!

He should be feeling it all out for AJ unless AJ tells him he doesn't want to go there (you know, like it would take more money than they pay Jeff Gordon for me to drive in NASCAR). :)

[Dr. Corkski]

Just because his name is Gesus doesn't mean its gospel. :gomer: