View Full Version : PT crashes in morning practice... removed by the safety team
devilmaster
04-14-07, 01:36 PM
rear end swapped when he got on the power out of 1
safety team straddling the nose, extricated with a possible neck brace
live on RD now
devilmaster
04-14-07, 01:50 PM
He went into the outside wall basically nose first perpendicular to the wall. the nose crushed to the top tip of the maple leaf emblem.
He removed his steering wheel right away, and was alert and awake when the safety team removed him to an ambulance.
devilmaster
04-14-07, 01:59 PM
according to T&S, paul has a sore neck but no other injuries.
:thumbup:
Thanks for the updates dm
Methanolandbrats
04-14-07, 02:07 PM
Really not that much to injure above PT's shoulders, he'll be ok.:)
Spicoli
04-14-07, 02:07 PM
:eek: :thumbup:
Insomniac
04-14-07, 02:43 PM
Yikes, I'm glad he will be okay. :thumbup:
TKGAngel
04-14-07, 02:52 PM
Per ESPN.com (http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?seriesId=5&id=2837486), Tracy's been taken to the hospital for precautionary X-rays after complaining of back pain.
devilmaster
04-14-07, 03:13 PM
Per ESPN.com (http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/news/story?seriesId=5&id=2837486), Tracy's been taken to the hospital for precautionary X-rays after complaining of back pain.
From that article:
http://assets.espn.go.com/i/rpm/mugs/65x90/742.jpg
This is a TKG pic from like, 97... no?
gotta update espn's photo database... :laugh:
PT's out for the race according to the CCWS site. :( The h8rs are gonna hafta h8 someone else for this race. :gomer:
-Kevin
Sean O'Gorman
04-14-07, 05:06 PM
Well at least there will be a clean start. Isn't Allmendinger available to race tomorrow?
The Doctor
04-14-07, 05:08 PM
Well at least there will be a clean start. Isn't Allmendinger available to race tomorrow?
He's available to race every Sunday, it's Friday when he's busy DNQing for NNC races. But Servia is racing for PT this weekend.
extramundane
04-14-07, 05:08 PM
http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/9629/untitled1ua6.jpg
Compression fracture of the first vertebra per T&S. Cookie boy takes over for the weekend. Get well soon, PT.
-Kevin
Audi_A4
04-14-07, 06:08 PM
Compression fracture of the first vertebra per T&S. Cookie boy takes over for the weekend. Get well soon, PT.
-Kevin
crap a broken back? I hope its not a flaw in the car .. how many backs did panoz break in that other series?
Hard Driver
04-14-07, 06:17 PM
That nose certainly doesn't look like it crushed much.
Does anyone know where this break is? Is this in the neck where the HANS device is supposed to help?
My initial guess is that Paul will be out for a while, if not the season. Anyone know how long this kind of recovery will take?
first lumbar vertebrae, which is lower back. Which is odd since you would think that part of the torso would be strapped in and supported well enough to prevent injury in this kind of relatively low speed front-end crash.
Looking at the pic above I'm wondering if it could have occurred when the tub slammed back down into the ground. In any case they need to look closely at the telemetry, the injury, and the cockpit safety systems just in case. None of this ignoring it until it happens five times crap.
nissan gtp
04-14-07, 06:43 PM
first lumbar vertebrae, which is lower back. Which is odd since you would think that part of the torso would be strapped in and supported well enough to prevent injury in this kind of relatively low speed front-end crash.
Looking at the pic above I'm wondering if it could have occurred when the tub slammed back down into the ground. In any case they need to look closely at the telemetry, the injury, and the cockpit safety systems just in case. None of this ignoring it until it happens five times crap.
agreed, they need to get on this to make sure there isn't a car problem
Dr. Corkski
04-14-07, 07:14 PM
Panoz backbreaking POS crapwagon.
Looking at the pic above I'm wondering if it could have occurred when the tub slammed back down into the ground. In any case they need to look closely at the telemetry, the injury, and the cockpit safety systems just in case. None of this ignoring it until it happens five times crap.
Good observation, boss. That was just confirmed on E$PN SC. Oh, and PT is out of action for 3 mos. :(
-Kevin
PT is out of action for 3 mos. :(
That sucks. :(
coolhand
04-14-07, 08:26 PM
first lumbar vertebrae, which is lower back. Which is odd since you would think that part of the torso would be strapped in and supported well enough to prevent injury in this kind of relatively low speed front-end crash.
Looking at the pic above I'm wondering if it could have occurred when the tub slammed back down into the ground. In any case they need to look closely at the telemetry, the injury, and the cockpit safety systems just in case. None of this ignoring it until it happens five times crap.
I think it has to do with seat position in openwheel cars, I don't know what the DP01s is like. Just a bump the wrong way and all that force goes to the spine
don't want to know how much a broken back must hurt... damn. :eek:
That sucks. :(
......:shakehead .....
Rogue Leader
04-14-07, 10:19 PM
Exactky what we did NOT need....
Arguably our biggest star out for 3 months... greaaaaaat
TKGAngel
04-14-07, 10:31 PM
According to ,,,,,, and the gang, PT's goal is to be back in time for Toronto, and he's going to be going to Indy to see Dr. Trammell.
Sean O'Gorman
04-14-07, 11:00 PM
Exactky what we did NOT need....
Arguably our biggest star out for 3 months... greaaaaaat
To be fair, thats like, what, two races?
To be fair, thats like, what, two races?
That's five counting Long Beach and assuming he can make Toronto.
TravelGal
04-15-07, 01:24 AM
PBBBBBBBBT. Always nice to see that SOG's a real fan, knows the schedule, and realizes that a joke is more important than the injury.
Tough day at the track today so I'm in no mood to read flip comments. It was not a car problem; they HAVE analyzed the telemetry. All you crepe hangers who want to find problems with the car, please go crepe on another thread and just send some positive thoughts Pau's way for the moment. He's obviously in pain, by the way he was walking when he got back from the hospital. Viv and Patti could use some kind thoughts also. Suck it up. Be nice, I know you can.
My contention is PT's car struck the wall almost head-on, in a slow speed crash that horizontally shifted his weight for a considerably longer period of time due to the nature of the crash. Because of the longer duration of the actual impact PT suffered the compression fracture as a result. Old bones, lack of calcium, perhaps even an old injury could have aided this result. At this time, there is NO evidence that the car design is at fault.
My question is how did the safety team know (within about 30 seconds) that PT was a 3? God bless the Safety Team and make a swift return PT.
It was not a car problem; they HAVE analyzed the telemetry. All you crepe hangers who want to find problems with the car, please go crepe on another thread and just send some positive thoughts Pau's way for the moment. I don't think saying that you want it to be looked at and not just dismissed out of hand means that you want to find problems with the car.
Insomniac
04-15-07, 07:46 AM
My contention is PT's car struck the wall almost head-on, in a slow speed crash that horizontally shifted his weight for a considerably longer period of time due to the nature of the crash. Because of the longer duration of the actual impact PT suffered the compression fracture as a result. Old bones, lack of calcium, perhaps even an old injury could have aided this result. At this time, there is NO evidence that the car design is at fault.
My question is how did the safety team know (within about 30 seconds) that PT was a 3? God bless the Safety Team and make a swift return PT.
PT said:
No, I just got on the power hard and the rear snapped and it just turned towards the wall. And, uhhh, it stopped just dead and it bounced up and slammed down on the ground and that compression just, you know, compressed the vertebrae.
Insomniac
04-15-07, 07:49 AM
Tough day at the track today so I'm in no mood to read flip comments. It was not a car problem; they HAVE analyzed the telemetry. All you crepe hangers who want to find problems with the car, please go crepe on another thread and just send some positive thoughts Pau's way for the moment. He's obviously in pain, by the way he was walking when he got back from the hospital. Viv and Patti could use some kind thoughts also. Suck it up. Be nice, I know you can.
I think the majority of people don't want anyone to get hurt, including IRL drivers. But just as a lot of us question those back-breaking cars, wse shouldn't keep our questions/discussions about how this injury happened to PT because we're CC fans. In the end, we want a safer car for the driver.
......:shakehead .....
Why the :shakehead ? Am I not supposed to be disappointed that PT will be out of action for so long?
I agree with your disappointment........it sucks that PT is injured and out.
Damn. Get well soon, PT.
At the LVGP, the kids were looking at the gokarts in the CC display. Of course, my kid hit the start button (why did they have a battery in the things?). Other kid asks where the horn was. About 3 of us, me, fan, kart guy all said in unison, "You use the chrome horn".
We need him back and healthy.:thumbup:
Accipiter
04-15-07, 11:35 AM
PT said:
No, I just got on the power hard and the rear snapped and it just turned towards the wall. And, uhhh, it stopped just dead and it bounced up and slammed down on the ground and that compression just, you know, compressed the vertebrae.
Essentially the same thing that happened to Memo Gidley last year in a DP.
The more upright seating postion of a Champ Car is better in any type of crash except ones that exert vertical force on the driver. Those being the least likely type, I think we can say there is not a huge safety issue here.
Chitowncartfreak
04-15-07, 11:57 AM
Essentially the same thing that happened to Memo Gidley last year in a DP.
The more upright seating postion of a Champ Car is better in any type of crash except ones that exert vertical force on the driver. Those being the least likely type, I think we can say there is not a huge safety issue here.
I would agree - not a huge safety issue with the car. Having said that, to ChampCar's credit, they will likely use this learning to have some improvements to the car available before the end of the season. Not only are Champ Car's among the safest cars in racing, the series is and has always been the most responsive in ensuring they remain the safest cars in racing.
Insomniac
04-15-07, 12:01 PM
Essentially the same thing that happened to Memo Gidley last year in a DP.
The more upright seating postion of a Champ Car is better in any type of crash except ones that exert vertical force on the driver. Those being the least likely type, I think we can say there is not a huge safety issue here.
Wouldn't there most likely be some vertical movement like that in any wheel to wheel contact?
How does the seating angle compare to F1? I know before, F1 was a higher angle than the Lola. Where is the Panoz?
Ed_Severson
04-15-07, 12:49 PM
I'm not sure how reclined the F1 guys are these days, but the seating position in the Lola was more upright for the torso than it is in the Panoz. That was something the designers felt would reduce the possibility of serious back injuries in rear-end-first accidents.
I'm not sure how reclined the F1 guys are these days, but the seating position in the Lola was more upright for the torso than it is in the Panoz. That was something the designers felt would reduce the possibility of serious back injuries in rear-end-first accidents.I thought that the reclined position is the reason why the crapwagons caused so many injuries. IOWs, more vertical is more better.
:confused:
Insomniac
04-15-07, 01:09 PM
I'm not sure how reclined the F1 guys are these days, but the seating position in the Lola was more upright for the torso than it is in the Panoz. That was something the designers felt would reduce the possibility of serious back injuries in rear-end-first accidents.
Isn't that backwards? Aren't the drivers sitting more upright in the DP01 compared to the Lola? I remember an angle of 60 degrees mentioned.
Edit: In this video (http://www.champcarworldseries.com/News/Article.asp?ID=9743), Scott Elkins says the driver will be more upright for better protection when the car backs into a wall.
vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfJbsrF4H0g)
Doesn't look that bad. WTF?
Ed_Severson
04-15-07, 01:41 PM
Nope, you're absolutely right. My fingers got ahead of my brain there. :tony:
What I meant to say was that the torso was less upright in the Lola than in the Panoz. Of course, this could make you more susceptible to injury from vertical loading, but is generally safer in horizontal impacts, which are far more common.
Insomniac
04-15-07, 02:59 PM
vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfJbsrF4H0g)
Doesn't look that bad. WTF?
It's possible it's too rigid and the deceleration in that direction (vertically) had a lot of Gs.
vid (http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AfJbsrF4H0g)
Doesn't look that bad. WTF?
Word. I think he had a bigger incident in his golf cart jumping incident. :saywhat: :gomer:
-Kevin
TravelGal
04-16-07, 01:10 AM
I don't think saying that you want it to be looked at and not just dismissed out of hand means that you want to find problems with the car.
You're right, of course. I forgot the OC propensity for having so few threads. To me, this was a thread about Paul being injured. It was not the place to immediately assume that the Panoz tubs are garbage, which is what it sounded like to me. It certainly was not dismissed out of hand. They studied the telemetry, etc.
As you all have said, there may be more to it than the precise cause. That does bear looking into.
diamond dave
04-16-07, 02:48 AM
Viv said PT didn't take any Meds. race morning when he got up:D
Accipiter
04-16-07, 11:34 AM
I'm not sure how reclined the F1 guys are these days,
They're reclined like they are sitting in a Lay-Z-Boy.
Insomniac
04-19-07, 09:02 AM
PT is hoping to be back by Portland.
And this about the injury:
The resulting injury seemed harsh for a 35 mph impact.
"Yeah, especially when I think about the time I crashed a Reynard in Homestead." continued Tracy. "It was my first test for Team Green and we stuck a blanket behind me because the seat didn't fit. I went into Turn 3, cut a tire and backed into the wall. The bulkhead went through the fuel cell but I walked away.
"I'm not sure why I got hurt like I did, there's a lot of theories out there. I just know I've got more room in this cockpit than I had in my old Lola."
http://www.speedtv.com/articles/auto/champcar/36802/
Add that to Wilson adding a lot of padding to make sure he was snug in there, maybe he just wasn't really tied in and that allowed for too much movement? Another theory: Making the DP01 so a tall guy like Justin can fit in more easily may've opened up some problems for shorter drivers?
Andrew Longman
04-19-07, 10:17 AM
He didn't get hurt at Homestead because the bulkhead went through the fuel cell.
In this case the drop was all absorbed by his spine. Still given that he dropped only a few feet, I'd be looking at the seat/seat design.
Insomniac
04-19-07, 10:54 AM
He didn't get hurt at Homestead because the bulkhead went through the fuel cell.
In this case the drop was all absorbed by his spine. Still given that he dropped only a few feet, I'd be looking at the seat/seat design.
Or the restarint system.
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