Bourdais testing Toro Rosso at Spa this week.

[Fio1]

Bourdais is testing today and tomorrow at Spa for Toro Rosso again.

Do you think he would leave Newman-Haas for Toro Rosso, or will he hold off for a better F1 offer?

And, if Bourdais left for F1 in 2008, would you cheer him on and wish him the best or be bitter that he left CCWS?

[G.]

I would cheer him on, at least until he came back to NASCAR.:p

I would want him with a good team, 'cuz I think he's a damn fine driver. The guy's a machine, when he ain't whining.

[Insomniac]

Bourdais is testing today and tomorrow at Spa for Toro Rosso again.

Do you think he would leave Newman-Haas for Toro Rosso, or will he hold off for a better F1 offer?

And, if Bourdais left for F1 in 2008, would you cheer him on and wish him the best or be bitter that he left CCWS?

I don't know if he would. He said in the past he only wanted a top ride and was disappointed Renault didn't have much interest in getting a French driver. Maybe if STR is the best seat he can get for now, he'll reconsider what he'd leave for.

I won't be bitter if he leaves CCWS. If Scott Speed gets the boot for Bourdais, that would suck. I wouldn't cheer him on either. I'm a bandwagon jumper. I like the second place and third place teams every year. :)

[Methanolandbrats]

I would cheer if he left :thumbup:

[Hard Driver]

He would grab it in a minute... no question.

Where do the top F1 teams get their drivers, often from a lower rung F1 team who has a driver that has proven themselves. Champcar is less of a proving ground to top F1 teams than Toro Rosso. So if he wants a drive with Renault, then he will have to step up to Toro Rosso to get to Renault.

Champcar is a great series, I would rather watch a Champcar race on TV because there is more passing and more drama and I don't know who will win before it starts half the time. BUt in terms of driver prestige, nothing compares to F1, even a Striker drive probably ranks above a N/H/L Champcar drive.

However, that said, I think that having Bourdais go and do well would reflect well on Champcar. I also think the cross pollination of drivers like Doornbos gives the series credibility that is needed. I know that having Champcar as an F1 feeder series is not what real champcar fans want in some way. However, before surpassing F1, you have to be considered 2nd to it. And if you are 2nd to it, it will be a feeder series. Right now, GP2 and a few others are probably considered higher in international racing prestige. So having Champcar be an F1 feeder series is still moving in the right direction.

[jonovision_man]

I hope he goes, and I really hope he does well.

After da Matta, ChampCar needs a graduate to succeed, doesn't look good for someone to dominate here then stink it up in F1.

jono

[Fio1]

I don't think he'll get a top line F1 drive, for a few reasons. First, those are pretty much spoken for. Second, this season Doornbos is doing as well if not better then Bourdais in CCWS and he didn't exactly set the world on fire in F1. F1 team owners will take that into consideration, because they know who Doornbos is, like they knew Justin Wilson. They really don't know how good the home-grown talent like PT & Allmendinger are. And finally, there is enough young talent around the GP2, DTM & A1GP paddock. Would Bourdais be better then Vetel, Hollenburg, Zuber, etc? Therefore, the Toro Rosso is probably his best bet. Too bad.

[jonovision_man]

The top contenders right now started out as close to the back of the grid as STR. Alonso and Fisi both started at Minardi, Kimi & Massa started at Sauber before they had manufacturer support.

There's Hamilton and Kovaleinen, but they both did a lot of testing and were groomed for those rides. They didn't just show up in F1 one day and get it handed to them.

Any F1 ride is great for a ChampCar grad these days, snap it up, be fast and move up the grid next time your contract is up...

jono

[pchall]

Is the worst ride in F1 better than the best ride in champcar? :eek:

[stroker]

I would cheer if he left :thumbup:

Roger that.

[Insomniac]

Is the worst ride in F1 better than the best ride in champcar? :eek:

Depends on what you're looking for.

[jonovision_man]

Is the worst ride in F1 better than the best ride in champcar? :eek:

Yes.

But STR isn't the worst ride, Spyker is.

jono

[Indy]

I would cheer for him. Despite the personality, he is very, very good and I appreciate seeing him drive.

[oddlycalm]

But STR isn't the worst ride, Spyker is. Absolutely, and STR will have better chassis going forward starting next year when they don't have to dance around to avoid the customer car issue. It's about as good a ride as Bourdais deserves until he's demonstated he deserves better IMO

oc

[diamond dave]

STR is no worse than Spyker or Factory Honda

[NismoZ]

Regarding best to worst, Doornbos has recently said he's had conversations about Spyker but wouldn't do it. He'd rather race for wins in ChampCar than be a backmarker in F-1, even for a Dutch team. Besides he gets to race in Holland anyway. CC is nowhere near as bad a place to to be as many of you would like the rest of us to believe. Bourdais said if he doesn't get the F-1 invite he's likely to remain in CC (as it is the next best paying option, not sportscars) or something with NASCAR opens up. After what Mark Martin said about him in IROC it's hard to believe somebody there isn't pushing harder in that direction especially after the moves by guys like Ambrose and Montoya. If Hornish heads to NASCAR next season would Penske try to grab him for the IRL!? :eek:

[jonovision_man]

I think that speaks more to the dire straights at Spyker than a general F1 thing... they've had a lot of trouble finishing races, and nobody's really convinced they'll be around. And they expect you to bring a large cheque, that could be the big hold-up for Doornbos. Albers was let go when his sponsor didn't pay up... had little to do with performance, team needed the coin.

ChampCar teams want you to bring a much smaller cheque. :)

Stoddart never had the budget to run F1 competitively, now he's having a great time winning races in Champcar. Good on him! The more guys like him we have around the better the series is.

I could go on and on on this subject... and it seems I already have. ;)

But F1 will always be F1, the pinnacle of motorsport, where the drivers really would love to be if they had the ability/money/whatever.

ChampCar is a decent place to make a career, it's more cost effective, and by all accounts it's a lot more fun. So good for the guys who find a good home in ChampCar and go out there and give 'er.

Signed,
The Doornbos fanclub. ;)

jono

[jonovision_man]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/60816

Interesting:

Q. Should an opportunity arise to race an F1 car this year, how do you feel? Would you be tempted?

SB: Well, it is impossible to say. You need to know what kind of conditions you will be racing under. I will give a thought, when you propose you have to think about it, but right now it has not even been proposed, so we have to wait and see. I doubt it will happen. I am pretty tied up with the Champ Car, I have got my own load of work, so it is pretty unlikely but anything could happen.

I have to be open, it is always difficult when you are doing a season already. When these opportunities arise there is always positives and negatives. You could be showing up at wrong moment. It is not often you get the Lewis (Hamilton) situation, you need to think it is the right moment for you to jump in the car.

jono

[Johnny Chicago]

I have a hard time believing that a guy that needs to test (audition) that many times for a team, is a sure thing. It tells me that they are still very undecided.

[RTKar]

Without a USGP in '08, there's a bullseye on Speed's back.

[jonovision_man]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/60940




"I have to say he delivered what we were expecting from him," the Austrian told a news conference at the European Grand Prix.

"He has been quick, consistent and good with the engineers. So I think he has a good potential," added the former Grand Prix winner. "We have an option on him until the end of the month."

[Spicoli]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/60940

Well, that pretty much sums it up. C-Ya.

[SurfaceUnits]

an option to do what, when?

[cameraman]

Whatever they want, whenever they want.
Beggars can't be choosers.

[jonovision_man]

http://www.f1i.com/content/view/7999/1/


As of right now, I'm trying to pursue everything I can in the F1 world, and we should have some news pretty soon," the Frenchman told the Tampa Tribune. He added: "If it doesn't come through, then yeah, NASCAR is definitely something I would be interested in."

Babelfish translation from Press Release Answer to Honest Answer:

I'd like to drive the most technologically advanced, nimble, sophisticated cars on the planet at the finest road circuits. But if not I'll take overweight tube-framed pieces of crap becuase at least I'd make more money than I am right now.

jono

[Racing Truth]

http://www.f1i.com/content/view/7999/1/



Babelfish translation from Press Release Answer to Honest Answer:


jono

:rofl: :rofl: :laugh:

Bourdais in NASCAR? Wow, guess anything's possible now.

[Spicoli]

Bourdaisy be too old.


Vettel is just a teenager, looked quick at USGP.....


Bernie hates us.

[jonovision_man]

From the Hungarian press conference...


Q. Sebastian, when did you know you were actually driving for Scuderia Toro Rosso?

:eek:

Oh wait, Vettel's first name is Sebastian too. :p Jerks.

jono

[Spicoli]

From the Hungarian press conference...



:eek:

Oh wait, Vettel's first name is Sebastian too. :p Jerks.

jono


sometimes you make funny.


this not one of them.

[jonovision_man]

:laugh:

[Spicoli]

:laugh:


Craig Hamsturd is upset with you. I'm very clsoe to these people you know,,,,

[NismoZ]

Speaking of money, rumor says Vettel is getting a whopping $165,000 to finish this season and gets 400k for all of next season. Berger has already refused to give support to Liuzzi while praising Bourdais so my guess is the holdup on announcements is from the Bourdais camp. If he wants to go home to Europe and race for a loser for less than he's worth he can do that. If he wants to stay here and race the NASCAB meatgrinder for millions he can do that, too. To race 20 times or so "at home" for millions? I seriously doubt it. I think Berger believes Bourdais wants F-1 so badly he'd do it for free. Don't do it Sebastian! I'd rather see how you match up against Marcus Ambrose! (3rd fast in P2 at Montreal behind Fellows and Robby! N/H/L/Y should get him too!):)

[jonovision_man]

Craig Hamsturd is upset with you. I'm very clsoe to these people you know,,,,

Someone needs to stop that guy... he makes it too easy for JW...

jono

[jonovision_man]

Speaking of money, rumor says Vettel is getting a whopping $165,000 to finish this season and gets 400k for all of next season. Berger has already refused to give support to Liuzzi while praising Bourdais so my guess is the holdup on announcements is from the Bourdais camp. If he wants to go home to Europe and race for a loser for less than he's worth he can do that. If he wants to stay here and race the NASCAB meatgrinder for millions he can do that, too. To race 20 times or so "at home" for millions? I seriously doubt it. I think Berger believes Bourdais wants F-1 so badly he'd do it for free. Don't do it Sebastian! I'd rather see how you match up against Marcus Ambrose! (3rd fast in P2 at Montreal behind Fellows and Robby! N/H/L/Y should get him too!):)

This reminds me of Wheldon's contract negotiations a few years ago... all of a sudden he's musing about NASCAR, F1, blah blah blah... just trying to make the other side think that he's got other opportunities.

I hope Bourdais doesn't pull a Verstappen and ask for more money than he should, there are guys lined up for that seat who would pay STR for it rather than the other way around!

jono

[NismoZ]

Exactly, so why do it? This is an F-1 career ENDER for Bourdais not the beginning of a long and successful career. If it was Ferrari or McLaren fighting for his services that'd be different. To go to F-1 just to say you did it? Beneath his dignity, I'd say. But, to race the high banks in 2 ton COTs swapping paint with the likes of Dale Freekin' Jr. for the big bucks? No brainer. He be drinkin' Perrier in victory lane!:D

[Methanolandbrats]

Exactly, so why do it? This is an F-1 career ENDER for Bourdais not the beginning of a long and successful career. If it was Ferrari or McLaren fighting for his services that'd be different. To go to F-1 just to say you did it? Beneath his dignity, I'd say. But, to race the high banks in 2 ton COTs swapping paint with the likes of Dale Freekin' Jr. for the big bucks? No brainer. He be drinkin' Perrier in victory lane!:D Frenchy will have to have food flown in at most of the Cab Tracks. I'd like to see him attack one of those pink hotdogs with the gray center they serve at Bristol. :D

[jonovision_man]

F1 is the pinnacle of motorsport.

If he has faith in his skills, he should go.

He isn't that old... 28... Red Bull is a good place to be, they have a sister team that has a big budget and a championship-winning designer in Newey. He could find himself fighting for wins and podiums in a couple years.

jono

[Spicoli]

F1 is the pinnacle of motorsport.

If he has faith in his skills, he should go.

He isn't that old... 28... Red Bull is a good place to be, they have a sister team that has a big budget and a championship-winning designer in Newey. He could find himself fighting for wins and podiums in a couple years.

jono


Put down the bong brotha! :rofl:

[jonovision_man]

Put down the bong brotha! :rofl:

Bookmark this thread... and bring it up in 2009.

Don't forget!!! ;)

We'll be hearing the french anthem in Monaco for a Bourdais win. :D OK that's pouring it on a little thick... but I don't see any reason he should fail, he's very quick and has the right temperament for F1.

He can drive fast, whine, and pout with the best of them.

jono

[NismoZ]

More like the PINOCHLE of motorsport! He should bring Newey with him to 'CAB for a N/H reunion.:thumbup: Now THAT'd be an engineering challenge!

[jonovision_man]

Webber's take...
http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61332


"The track record for American racers coming over this way shows it is pretty difficult," Webber said. "JPM (Juan Pablo Montoya) and Jacques [Villeneuve] are the only two recently to have been successful, and then you have to go back to Mario [Andretti].

I don't know where to start. :) How many others have had the chance?? It's not like there's a long list in recent years who have tried and failed.


"It's as close as F1 has ever been. Given how much the field has closed up with how the tyres are and so on, it's probably a bit easier to come in now than at any other time. There is less to get on top of, like a tyre war and things like that."

jono

[Methanolandbrats]

Monty and Jesus are Americans? :confused: It's a bit easier to get on top of F1 now? No Mark, that means you measure the gap in seconds instead of 10s of seconds, but it's just as hard. Weber is not only an ***hole, he's stupid.

[TKGAngel]

Looks like Torro Rosso finally shat and got off the pot.

Good luck to SeeBass.

http://www.tsn.ca/auto_racing/news_story/?ID=215853&hubname=

[jonovision_man]

We can't possibly complain about F1 not finalizing its driver line-ups 6 months before their season when ChampCar finalizes them during the practice session of the first race! :)

jono

[Wally]

Good Luck to Sebass......:thumbup:

[jonovision_man]

Indeed! I hope he kicks some serious butt and does ChampCar proud. :thumbup:

jono

[NismoZ]

So, Wilson? Heck, I'd take Bruno back. No young Euro upstarts. An Atlantic upstart? Matos? He's bested both Marco and Rahal remember. Wouldn't look good for KK's guys to get the $2mil. so maybe King Carl snags him? Haas has always gone for the best available so I think Justin has the inside line but who knows? Maybe we'll all be surprised when Jensen Button suits up because he wants to win a race or two!:D

[Wheel-Nut]

CC needs more young American drivers.

[Gnam]

Bon. :thumbup:

Like a baby bird fallen from the nest, will F1 reject him because he smells of America?

[jonovision_man]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61510


Da Matta backs Bourdais's F1 switch

...
"When you get the chance, even at 28 years old and even with a team you know might not be able to win or compete for championships, you have to take it because you never know what will happen,"


A bit of a change of tune from da Matta, no? He was very down on F1 when he decided (snicker) to come back to ChampCar.

jono

[Rogue Leader]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61510



A bit of a change of tune from da Matta, no? He was very down on F1 when he decided (snicker) to come back to ChampCar.

jono


That is a change... but understandable. Because as much as Toyota and his situation there sucked, F1 is still F1, and like Perry McCarthy I would rather be out there DNPQing in an Andrea Moda, then not be there at all ever....

[jonovision_man]

Interesting to see Bergher's though process behind giving Bourdais a shot...

Read the whole thing here, it's very interesting. It makes perfect sense - other teams get top drivers by paying huge money, they're trying to do it on the cheap, so they look at who has the most potential but also experience out there.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61534


Berger said that the decision to pursue Bourdais was prompted by the team feeling that he was their best opportunity to get a true frontline driver.

"It was a bit early for Toro Rosso to get one of the quick guys like (Fernando) Alonso and (Lewis) Hamilton. And at the end of the day the driver is becoming more and more important, especially next year with traction control gone.

"We thought it wise to look at a young one, but not just young ones, one with a bit of race experience. So we had to look at others, some of the others with potential, and not yet in F1. And the only one was Bourdais.

"I have looked at him for two years and I always asked myself, just how good is he? He did an excellent job in America, he won F3, F3000, he won three times Champ Car and he is leading this time, so theoretically there is potential. And I still it is fine to take the risk.

"Let's give him the chance, that is what we did in testing, and also in testing he did a good job for us, he worked well with the engineers, he was quick straightaway, he did not do any damage, he was very fit.

"Everything he did he showed his potential. We thought it could be a chance for us to get a really, really good driver."


jono

[Spicoli]

Interesting to see Bergher's though process behind giving Bourdais a shot...

Read the whole thing here, it's very interesting. It makes perfect sense - other teams get top drivers by paying huge money, they're trying to do it on the cheap, so they look at who has the most potential but also experience out there.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/61534



jono


Oh. So Hamilton and Alonso might come next year to TR? :laugh:

[NismoZ]

And the only "race" Bourdais has next year is to outperform Vettel. If he can do that is he a success in F-1?

[Insomniac]

And the only "race" Bourdais has next year is to outperform Vettel. If he can do that is he a success in F-1?

Depends on how much. If he makes it obvious he's better than his teammate, and better than the car he's in, then he could be in line for a better ride.

[chop456]

he won F3, F3000

No he didn't.

[cameraman]

2002
Won FIA International F3000 Championship, winning races at Imola, Monaco and Nurburgring as well as seven pole positions while driving for Super Nova Racing. Earned seven podiums and turned fastest race lap in three events. Won two races in FIA Sport competition and also co-drove the Team Labre machine to victory in the 24 Hours of Spa.


1999
Won French Formula 3 Championship, winning eight races, three poles and setting four fastest race laps. Competed in his first 24 Hours of Le Mans.

[Ankf00]

technically he did, but only b/c Enge was excluded for smoking some bud

[Gnam]

scoreboard (http://www.fia.com/mediacentre/Press_Releases/FIA_Sport/2002/231202-01.html) :thumbup:


on a side note, what's wrong with Enge these days? He recovers from a heavy crash only to wipe Ferrari out of two races and get himself fired. He should write a country western song.

[jonovision_man]

And the only "race" Bourdais has next year is to outperform Vettel. If he can do that is he a success in F-1?

If he doesn't, he's a failure.

But I think it takes more than just beating a rookie green teammate to be a success, he'll have to be consistent, qualify well, give good feedback, just generally be the whole package.


jono

[Hard Driver]

Don't forget to add, that in that team, he needs to kiss butt and keep his mouth shut.