Sears / Kenmore Rant (!warning! Extremely long and overly narrative!)

[Sean Malone]

Sears / Kenmore Rant –

First a short back story; last year we decided to replace our aging dishwasher. It was a basic Maytag, about 6 years old, and was starting to leak and look old etc. My mother had mentioned to me how much she loved her new (at the time) Kenmore. It was a two stage with built in disposal model. Not top of the line but not basic either. So, taking her advice we went to Sears and bought a new Kenmore; basic, single stage with no disposal. We knew we were moving so it was all we needed. It was a fine dishwasher. No problems. We liked the layout, relatively quite for a basic model and only cost like $300.

Fast forward to present day; As some may recall I took a position with a company in Tampa earlier this year and we transitioned to FL from VA. We were renting until we found a house which we found “our house” last month, bought it, moved in two weeks ago and immediately went about replacing the 14 year old Whirlpools (that all worked fine but were old, dirty and old). So, based on our recent experience with the other dishwasher, we bee lined straight to Sears to pick out our appliances. High on a perception that Kenmore’s were the end all/be all for consumer level appliances (based on many hours of internet research), we decided their new ‘Pro’ line was what we wanted to equip our new “dream house” with. Top o’ the line, “commercial like” look blah, blah, we walked away with their best front loading washing machine/dryer (these are the Kenmore Elite which is between the Pro and basic Kenmore lines, but they don’t make a Pro series washing machine dryer), the Pro dishwasher (3 stage, virtually silent, with disposal) and their Pro side-by-side fridge. The dishwasher and fridge, in order to obtain the “commercial like” appearance, are…stainless steel. We’ve had stainless steel appliances for the last ten years. (Initiate segue…)

Delivered and installed two weeks ago on the weekend we were moving from the rental to the new place. They were just what we wanted. All is good. We went out to dinner that night, came back and spent the first night in our new house. The next morning my daughter was making herself something to eat and loudly exclaimed “ewww!”, she held her hand up to show us that after grabbing the handle of the fridge, her hand was covered in a brownish-red powdery dirt. A quick examination of the fridge revealed that this substance entirely coated the stainless steel front. How did we not notice this when it was delivered, we questioned ourselves. The answer is that it is such a fine powdery substance that it really didn’t show itself until you disturbed it (like ran a finger down the front). My wife, while I sat and scratched my head and said things like “hmm, and “uh weird”) went over the dishwasher and discovered it also was covered in the same substance. I grabbed the stainless steel cleaner that came with the appliances and cleaned a section of the fridge. Removing the dirty with the cleaner left the finish with a yellow tint with variations in color.

I dug up the Sears customer service #, explained the issue and requested an exchange of the dishwasher and fridge (so far so good on the laundry appliances) and was told that a technician would need to be dispatched and he/she would make the determination that it could be exchanged or repaired. Ok, if that’s the policy. (FYI…we paid an extra $300 per appliance for the Sears no hassle warranty. Over $8000 in appliances and ‘special’ warranties). So, I was informed that they could have someone out Thursday during 11 to 2 (which we couldn’t do) or Saturday. The only window they can give for Saturdays is 8 to 5 but was told that Friday an automated system would call us to give a narrower window. Friday comes…the automated call comes and informed me that someone would be out on Saturday between…8 and 5. Doh! No worries though. I’m pretty easy going with this kind of stuff. **** happens etc. the tech would come out, determine that an exchange was in order and that would be the end of it.

Rewind two days. We use the dishwasher for the first time following the exact first time instructions in the owners manual. Everything came out with the most hardened on soap scum I have ever seen. Frustrated, I ran it through another cycle with no soap and no heat dry. Didn’t work, still scummed up. Removed all items, hand rinsed them and then ran them through a third time, again with no soap…soap scum returneth. Keep in mind, this is supposed to be the best dishwasher Kenmore makes, thus the usage of “Pro” in its name and a $1400 price tag (and we paid $300 more for the service plan). Note to self to mention to tech. Oh, and wife has lost all confidence in 1. Sears and 2. the Kenmore Pro line. She wants a refund, not an exchange. I calm her feathers a bit because, well, I really like the way they look.

Fast forward three days – the day of the tech!

Happily unpacking things in our new house and waiting for Mr Tech to come out…phone rings at 12:30pm. It’s Sears, they are sorry that we were not home when the tech came to our house and when would we like to reschedule this appointment? Wha, wha what?!!! No tech ever came! The three of us haven’t left the house all morning. “Well,” she said, “he didn’t really come to your house, it’s procedure to call first to make sure you are home and you didn’t answer your phone”. “Um, wrong. First,” I explained, “the phone hasn’t rung once. Second, we had an appointment. An appointment that was verified by your automated system. We’ve been waiting here all morning!”. Her reply…”sorry sir, we have to reschedule”.
Now I’m pissed. I call customer service (she was ‘scheduling’ department. I’m discovering that dealing with Sears is like dealing with the government. There is tons of red tape, 100 different customer service departments and attitudes.)
Customer service verified that it is procedure for the tech to call prior to coming out but that he should have called three times and called the secondary # (my cell) also. He didn’t. The updated their “system” with a note explaining this but informed me that I had to call my local Sears dispatch office in order to see if there was a possibility that they could re-dispatch the same tech or re-route another one. This has been about 30 minutes on the phone with Sears. 20 more minutes on the phone with ‘dispatch’. The result, the tech has been routed…no est. arrival time though. Could be an hour, could be four more hours.

Fast forward 3 hours – the tech arrives!!

He goes over to the dishwasher, looks at it, strokes his chin, hmm and ahs for a minute and says “I’ll just put another door on it.” Ok, what does that entail? Tech says “ I’ll order the part. Once it’s in you’ll get a call to schedule me to come back out. Ok, it’s progress. What about the soap scum? He said we used too much soap. User error. BS!!

At that point I say…”so the same thing with the refrigerator? You’ll just put two new doors on it?” “Nope,” he says, “I’m a dishwasher repairman, not a refrigerator repairman. You’ll need to call Sears and schedule a time for a fridge tech”. “But it’s the same problem!” I explain, trying to keep my cool. He shrugs his shoulders. (sidenote; my dad said we may need a water softener. FL has very hard water and this may be the cause of the soap scum issue. Note that the tech didn’t mention a softner at all. Simply chalkded it up to us using too much soap).

(picture cartoon with guy with steam coming out of his ears)

I immediately pick up the phone to call Sears. I’m done. I want my money back. They are only a week old!
They bounce me around for 20 minutes (while one snotty CSR tells me I should call the repair mans boss and then hangs up on me!!), I’ve told my story to five different people and I end up talking with a girl in ‘warranties and exchanges’. She listens well, but ultimately says that in order for me to return them a tech would have to verify four times that the unit is un-repairable. Four times! That’s a lot of 8 to 5 on Saturdays!

That does it, the steam is still pouring and I’m furious. I ask her if Sears has a grievance/complaints department that she could transfer me to. She said they have a department called One Source. 15 minutes on hold I get Lisa. Lisa is another good listener, I can tell she was intelligent and looked at thing logically. I told my whole story to her to which she asked the question…do you want to refund them or repair them? I said, “Well, we’re looking at three Saturdays worth of sitting waiting for techs to come (if they come) or one Saturday waiting for the delivery guys to pick them up. I really like the look, I would actually just like an exchange on the two units but I was told by the warranties girl that a tech had to verify four times that it’s a lemon.”. Lisa said “no way! That’s just standard lemon law. You can get a full refund or exchange within 30 days of purchase but because you purchased the service plan on each item you can do this anytime you want.” I said “do it.”
“No problem”, Lisa said, “you’ll just need to call dispatch on Monday to schedule when the delivery guys will come and get the old ones and deliver the new ones.

Fine with me.

Fast forward to Monday. I call Sears; Lisa had updated the system to show the exchange but I was informed that Sears calls me when they know when they can do this. They said they are running a back log and I should get a call by Wednesday.

Fast forward to Wednesday evening…still no call.

Fast forward to today…I call customer service and they say it’s still in pending status and that there may be a delay getting the new units from the manufacturer but to hang in there.

Here I am hanging. Will the exchange take place? Will the units have the mysterious powdery dirt? Will the new dishwasher leave soap scum? Will I ever do business with Sears again?

FYI…most Kenmore appliances are manufactured for Sears by Whirlpool. The 14 year old appliances that were in the house were all Whirlpool and all worked flawlessly, even the microwave, which is so old that it doesn’t even have a popcorn button and no turn table, but still works great and is very solid. The Kenmore Pro series in made by Electrolux who makes vacuums and commercial/residential appliances in Europe. I wish they were made by Whirlpool.

It will be awhile before I go back to Sears. I kinda thought that I had found a really cool thing that only people over 50 know about. But I think my dad still likes them because they still do business like its 1966.

[extramundane]

I feel your pain. At my last house, it took Sears 5 weeks to repair the central air unit because 1 tech kept ordering replacement parts and another tech kept insisting the whole unit needed replacing.

Note that the only reason they were involved at all was due to their being the on-site contractor for the home warranty company. Every time I see a Sears Home Service commercial now, I have an odd compulsion to throw things.

[indyfan31]

Wow, that really does sound like dealing with the government (... I should know).
Sorry to hear you're having all those problems at once. In a strange bit of irony, my appliances have always been Kenmore, except my dishwasher; I went straight to Maytag. My fridge did need service for the icemaker once. Luckily I got great service from both the CSR and the tech.

[mapguy]

I used to work for Sears Home Repair. I was an HVAC/Refrigeration tech.

First of all. Their dispatch does suck. Big time. The 1-800 number routes you to either somewhere in Texas or Phoenix. Then they route the call to the district center. (Mine was based in Rochester, NY) and the people there are retards. The routing/scheduling are a nightmare. Before Kmart bought Sears we had our routing office at our home base, so they knew the geography. These 'tards would often add a call on to me near the end of my day when I was in, say, Delmar or Albany, and have me drive to Glens Falls or Saratoga during evening rush hour.

Secondly, when I finish a call I would call the next customer on my route. If there was no reponse on the primary number, I would leave a message and then call the secondary number. If there was still no response I would leave a message and then call routing. They would then call both numbers and leave messages on both, after that the call would be taken off my route. Don't know what happened there but it sounds like the tech(s) blew you off.

Thirdly (is that a word?), there is no 'do-all' tech at Sears. They are grouped into specialties. Mainly because of parts on the truck. Like I mentioned, I specialized in HVAC (which includes heating and cooling, refrigerators, dehumidifiers and water softeners). Then there is cooking, excersize eqiupment and lawn and garden. So it sounds like there was a major screw up with routing.

Fourthly, Kenmore does not make any appliances. They are all made by everyone else. From Amana to Whirlpool. The first three digits on the model number signifies the manufacturer. When you buy the stuff, if you ask, the Sears sales person HAS to tell you who makes it.

So I hope that helps. PM me if you have any specific questions.

BTW. If anyone is buying a new fridge. Here is my advice. Stay away from the 'Trios' the ones with the bottom freezer and two upper doors. At least for another year or so. Doesn't matter who makes it. They all have the same Tecumseh compressor. This one sucks. Notorious for locked rotors. Even when new.

Top manufacturers:

Amana, Whirlpool, Kitchen-Aid, Maytag. (all same company now.)
Beleive it or not. Samsung.

Avoid:

LG. The only person I would recommend one of these to is FTG.

GE. 15 years ago they made good ****. Now they are all pretty much made in Korea by LG.

Fridgidaire. I'd love to meet the engineers who design their **** and slam the fridge door on their head yelling "what the fook were you thinking?!"

As for HVAC. Lennox, Trane or Carrier. (American Standard is Trane) Anything else is garbage. Except for Buderus boilers.


Hoped this helped.

[mapguy]

My fridge did need service for the icemaker once.



Don't EVER call service to replace an icemaker. (Unless you have a Whirlpool side-by-side). A replacement (or repair) will run you $250 easily. Go to a local appliance parts place and buy an ice maker for about $50 bucks. These things are so easy to install even Spicoli can do it.

[Andrew Longman]

Realize now Maytag is owned by Whirlpool and the bulletproof Maytag washing machine design that has been around since WWII is being phased out. They've already cheapened the main seal to ensure it won't last more than about 5-7 years and you'll be prompted with the choice between a major repair and buying a new washer.

I have a similar story about a Fridgidare washer. Sean, your story was long enough so I spare us the full version, but the short of it was the design vented steam such that it cooked its electronic and badly damaged my brand new Corean countertop.

Several rounds of service technician visit later they hauled it away. (BTW these techs ALWAYS require two visits because they carry no parts. They always will need to return once they order the part, which YOU have to tell them when it arrives. This was my experience with Dodge service too)

Happy ending, and maybe this is an option with you, is we decided to take the issue to Lowes where we bought it. Screw Fridgidare, they don't care what we think, but Lowes want our business for more than just washers. My wife got the Lowes store manager on the phone and he said to come straight to the store. He spent about 90 minutes with her picking out a new dishwasher. In the end she settled on a KitchenAid that cost over $200 more than the Fridgidare. She went to pay the difference and he simply said no, it will be delivered tomorrow.

[KLang]

I've had good luck so far with Sears appliance service. We live out in the boonies and haven't found anyone else to dependably show up for a scheduled service call. Had a few Kenmore things over the years, only real problem so far was a Calypso washer that liked to grow mold and mildew. Common problem from what I've read on the internet. Just replaced it with a new Oasis model. They now have a new 'clean' cycle to remove the mold with bleach. :laugh:

Our new house is all Kitchen-Aid. Microwave didn't work properly from day one. Took Kitchen-Aid three weeks to get if fixed. :mad: Waiting to see how the rest of the stuff works out although as mapguy pointed out, it's all really Whirlpool anyway.

[mapguy]

Happy ending, and maybe this is an option with you, is we decided to take the issue to Lowes where we bought it. Screw Fridgidare, they don't care what we think, but Lowes want our business for more than just washers. My wife got the Lowes store manager on the phone and he said to come straight to the store. He spent about 90 minutes with her picking out a new dishwasher. In the end she settled on a KitchenAid that cost over $200 more than the Fridgidare. She went to pay the difference and he simply said no, it will be delivered tomorrow.

I work for Lowe's now. ;) They are fast approaching Sears for the largest appliance retailer. Problem is, the service contract you buy is taken care by Sears through their A&E service. All the same people. Just different logos on the trucks and uniforms. Also, Maytag repair was bought over by Sears earlier this year. So, unless you go with a local repair man (good luck) you have to deal with Sears.

[Sean Malone]

I used to work for Sears Home Repair. I was an HVAC/Refrigeration tech.

First of all. Their dispatch does suck. Big time. The 1-800 number routes you to either somewhere in Texas or Phoenix. Then they route the call to the district center. (Mine was based in Rochester, NY) and the people there are retards. The routing/scheduling are a nightmare. Before Kmart bought Sears we had our routing office at our home base, so they knew the geography. These 'tards would often add a call on to me near the end of my day when I was in, say, Delmar or Albany, and have me drive to Glens Falls or Saratoga during evening rush hour.

Secondly, when I finish a call I would call the next customer on my route. If there was no reponse on the primary number, I would leave a message and then call the secondary number. If there was still no response I would leave a message and then call routing. They would then call both numbers and leave messages on both, after that the call would be taken off my route. Don't know what happened there but it sounds like the tech(s) blew you off.

Thirdly (is that a word?), there is no 'do-all' tech at Sears. They are grouped into specialties. Mainly because of parts on the truck. Like I mentioned, I specialized in HVAC (which includes heating and cooling, refrigerators, dehumidifiers and water softeners). Then there is cooking, excersize eqiupment and lawn and garden. So it sounds like there was a major screw up with routing.

Fourthly, Kenmore does not make any appliances. They are all made by everyone else. From Amana to Whirlpool. The first three digits on the model number signifies the manufacturer. When you buy the stuff, if you ask, the Sears sales person HAS to tell you who makes it.

So I hope that helps. PM me if you have any specific questions.

BTW. If anyone is buying a new fridge. Here is my advice. Stay away from the 'Trios' the ones with the bottom freezer and two upper doors. At least for another year or so. Doesn't matter who makes it. They all have the same Tecumseh compressor. This one sucks. Notorious for locked rotors. Even when new.

Top manufacturers:

Amana, Whirlpool, Kitchen-Aid, Maytag. (all same company now.)
Beleive it or not. Samsung.

Avoid:

LG. The only person I would recommend one of these to is FTG.

GE. 15 years ago they made good ****. Now they are all pretty much made in Korea by LG.

Fridgidaire. I'd love to meet the engineers who design their **** and slam the fridge door on their head yelling "what the fook were you thinking?!"

As for HVAC. Lennox, Trane or Carrier. (American Standard is Trane) Anything else is garbage. Except for Buderus boilers.


Hoped this helped.

Very interesting map! My wife wanted a bottom freezer model but I talked her into the Kenmore Pro just based on looks (I'm a sucker for cool looking appliances). Good to know about the compressors.
Also, our first choice before the Kenmore Pro was the new Samsung line. I am really impressed with all of the Samsung line as far as looks and features (I don't know about their reliability).

My sister in law bought the LG front load washer and dryer last year. A grand each. They've been in the "shop" twice already.

[Ankf00]

As for HVAC. Lennox, Trane or Carrier. (American Standard is Trane) Anything else is garbage. Except for Buderus boilers.


isn't one of Lennox or Trane just a rebadged Carrier? It may be York? I can't remember which one I got for my folks...

[mapguy]

isn't one of Lennox or Trane just a rebadged Carrier? It may be York? I can't remember which one I got for my folks...

Lennox, Trane and Carrier are all seperate. York is old school and don't know who owns them know. Mainly commercial stuff. Residentail boilers are probably run off of goat dung.....:gomer:

[cameraman]

You have to very, very careful about the very high end kitchen appliances. Many rich folk around here have bazillion dollar houses out in the sticks which in Utah that can be a 4-5 hour drive from a major city. When their $2500 cooktop breaks down - well - no repairman is willing to drive all day to fix it. The Utah countryside is littered with slightly dead very high end appliances.

[mapguy]

You have to very, very careful about the very high end kitchen appliances. Many rich folk around here have bazillion dollar houses out in the sticks which in Utah that can be a 4-5 hour drive from a major city. When their $2500 cooktop breaks down - well - no repairman is willing to drive all day to fix it. The Utah countryside is littered with slightly dead very high end appliances.

Really? Might be worth a road trip. Rent a pickup. Throw those babies in the back. $100 worth of parts and I've got a kitchen that Emeril would be proud of. :)

[RaceGrrl]

Sean- we had a similar problem with Sears service. Nothing much to say except that it sux. :mad:

Why on earth would anyone want a fridge with the freezer on the bottom? The house we rented for vacation this year had one of those and it was a giant PIA.

[Ankf00]

Lennox, Trane and Carrier are all seperate. York is old school and don't know who owns them know. Mainly commercial stuff. Residentail boilers are probably run off of goat dung.....:gomer:

I was thinking about Bryant. Residential though.

[Wheel-Nut]

York / Johnson Controls - PG!!!

http://www.york.com/

[cameraman]

Residentail boilers are probably run off of goat dung.....:gomer: You would probably get a kick out of my mother in-law's 1915 vintage boiler. It was a coal fired boiler but was converted to natural gas in the 20's. The entire unit is encased in an insulating asbestos dome which is roughly the size of a Mini Cooper. It is a gravity hot water system that is amazingly efficient especially given its extreme age. The boiler people who come to check it every year strongly recommend that if it isn't broke, don't touch it. Especially since there has to be several hundred pounds of asbestos down there.:eek: (All neatly painted in place)

[Andrew Longman]

I work for Lowe's now. ;) They are fast approaching Sears for the largest appliance retailer. Problem is, the service contract you buy is taken care by Sears through their A&E service. All the same people. Just different logos on the trucks and uniforms. Also, Maytag repair was bought over by Sears earlier this year. So, unless you go with a local repair man (good luck) you have to deal with Sears.

Fortunately for me I am pretty handy. I haven't used the repair service unless its still under warranty. Otherwise I have a local appliance shop that sells me parts and gives me advice and copies of repair manual pages for free. Only when I need a special tool (as I did to replace the main seal on my washer) I'll bring their service guy in. Beyond that, I just buy new.

But my experience with Lowes (paired with Home Depot seeming never to have what I'm looking for) has bought a lot of loyaty and goodwill. That manager knew my wife had been through enough and it wasn't about the $200 dollars anymore.

BTW I can also recommend the KitchenAid. I've had it a few years now and we love it.

[rosawendel]

This happened to a friend of mine (although it was at HHGregg, not Sears).

He used a credit card NOT ISSUED BY THE STORE. When he had problems with his new appliances, after the second visit, he had enough. He called the credit card company who scheduled a refund, put his appliances in the garage and bought new again from another store. Then he called HH and scheduled for the pickup of the (now older) appliances by HH - around HIS schedule, not HH's.

[oddlycalm]

GE. 15 years ago they made good ****. Now they are all pretty much made in Korea by LG. Very true, the appliance landscape has changed in a big way and GE's giant appliance factory in Kentucky that was shiny and new in the late 80's is now 20yrs old and hurting.

Cameraman and KLang made an important point as well; don't buy something that you can't get service for.

One additional comment about the "high end" brands is know what you're buying. Everybody and their dog makes a stainless steel cabinet depth refrigerator for silly money, but most are simply fancied up versions of the same old boxes with "Professional Line" or "Signature Series" in script to justify doubling or tripling the price. A fancied up Whilpool with a different name badge is not the same as a Subzero so don't get suckered into paying serious money for one. Same thing with front loading laundry equipment; a shiny new LG at the big box store may look great but it is not remotely the same underneath as a Bosch or Miele. Stainless steel is simply the finish de jour, the harvest gold or avacado green of the new century, it's not a guarantee of quality and the very same appliance can be had in white for a lot less.

A real high end fridge has dual compressors (one for refrigerator and one for freezer) and they are top mounted so they can be accessed for service without pulling the unit. This actually does as it allows quicker recovery after the door is opened. Yes, food actually does last longer before going bad because the temperature is constant.

The other thing to know is that while the high end stuff has increased in price some over the last 10yrs it's been a much smaller increase than the "pretend" high end models. We see $10,000 builder appliance packages going into expensive new homes and it's all generic crap in a fancied up finish.

oc

[Ankf00]

Stainless steel is simply the finish de jour, the harvest gold or avacado green of the new century, it's not a guarantee of quality and the very same appliance can be had in white for a lot less.

oc the stainless look is soooooooooooooo late 90's/turn of the century, it's all about solids and color variations now [/homobilly] :tony:

[mapguy]

Sean- we had a similar problem with Sears service. Nothing much to say except that it sux. :mad:

Shoulda called me. I had a gas card and an EZPass on my truck. All I would have charged was a clean bed and plenty of dark, bitter beer. But no, you had to be all hoity-toity and call service. ;)

BTW. Sorry I missed your B-Day Missy. Hope it was a good one!


Why on earth would anyone want a fridge with the freezer on the bottom?

I thought that same way too. When the Mrs. and I were shopping for appliances when we bought our first house I wanted a side-by-side. She wanted a bottom-mount. We compromised. So we got a bottom-mount.


I love it. 9 times out of 10 when you go in the fridge you have to bend down to find the mustard. With a bottom mount you open the door and there it is.

Down side is that I don't get to see the Mrs bending over to look for her hummus.

[Spicoli]

Don't EVER call service to replace an icemaker. (Unless you have a Whirlpool side-by-side). A replacement (or repair) will run you $250 easily. Go to a local appliance parts place and buy an ice maker for about $50 bucks. These things are so easy to install even Spicoli can do it.

That's not nice.

[Sean Malone]

Very true, the appliance landscape has changed in a big way and GE's giant appliance factory in Kentucky that was shiny and new in the late 80's is now 20yrs old and hurting.

Cameraman and KLang made an important point as well; don't buy something that you can't get service for.

One additional comment about the "high end" brands is know what you're buying. Everybody and their dog makes a stainless steel cabinet depth refrigerator for silly money, but most are simply fancied up versions of the same old boxes with "Professional Line" or "Signature Series" in script to justify doubling or tripling the price. A fancied up Whilpool with a different name badge is not the same as a Subzero so don't get suckered into paying serious money for one. Same thing with front loading laundry equipment; a shiny new LG at the big box store may look great but it is not remotely the same underneath as a Bosch or Miele. Stainless steel is simply the finish de jour, the harvest gold or avacado green of the new century, it's not a guarantee of quality and the very same appliance can be had in white for a lot less.

A real high end fridge has dual compressors (one for refrigerator and one for freezer) and they are top mounted so they can be accessed for service without pulling the unit. This actually does as it allows quicker recovery after the door is opened. Yes, food actually does last longer before going bad because the temperature is constant.

The other thing to know is that while the high end stuff has increased in price some over the last 10yrs it's been a much smaller increase than the "pretend" high end models. We see $10,000 builder appliance packages going into expensive new homes and it's all generic crap in a fancied up finish.

oc

Excellent points oc, and believe me I never went into the Kenmore Pro series thinking it was actually professional, subzero, dual compressor standards. I was hoping that it was as advertised; the best Kenmore model they offered. I'm extremely disappointed with the dishwasher, and I had high hopes for that unit as it does have all the bells and whistles, not just a $100 stainless steel fascia.

[Methanolandbrats]

The good thing about buying appliances from Sears is their parts network. Even if you bought it 30 years ago, you can order parts and have them on your doorstep the next day. Try that with the local appliance store or Lowes.
Of course that assumes you can fix your own stuff when the parts arrive :D

[chop456]

Sears is great. You go there and get a good price quote, then take it to the locally-owned retailer, have them match the price, deliver and haul away the old stuff for free. :thumbup:

[cameraman]

Things could always be worse, you could own a Maytag Neptune washer/dryer like I do. I will never, ever buy anything Maytag again.:flame:

[chop456]

^ Neighbor has those. The replacement control panel for the washer cost more than my washing machine did. :laugh:

[cameraman]

Been there, done that. ****ing motor control circuit board goes out. Can you get a new board? Yes but you need to buy a new drive motor at the same time since they have since changed the motor specs to keep the replacement board from frying. So you get to pay $450 to cover our **** up. Asshats. And now the piece of **** is starting to have mold problems. Now I have to wash a washing machine. The turds at Maytag call it an act of nature and it is my problem. Well *******s, you will never get another penny out of me and I will make damned sure that everyone and anyone who asks knows what crap product design and customer service Maytag has. You want an enemy, well you just got one.:flame:

[KLang]

And now the piece of **** is starting to have mold problems. Now I have to wash a washing machine. The turds at Maytag call it an act of nature and it is my problem.

Same problem our Calypso had. We were told to run bleach through it. Then we were told to try liquid dishwashing soap. Problem is with the automatic load sensor won't fill the thing up enough to get to the mold. Thus the self clean cycle on the new Oasis model.

[Methanolandbrats]

:rofl:
http://www.brandwrite.com/Portfolio_Files/Port_Print_Files/2head-Maytag-XtraMile/maytag1.jpg

[cameraman]

I've been told a cup of (powder version only) Cascade dishwashing detergent plus a cup of bleach in the detergent dispenser and the hot water cycle. The none sudsing detergent part is important. That and keep the door open at all times so it will dry out. At least that shouldn't be a problem in Utah with relative humidity levels in the low teens much of the time.:rolleyes:

[KLang]

That and keep the door open at all times so it will dry out.

I always thought that was probably the best solution but we have two cats. They would have ended up in the washer, no doubt in my mind. :laugh:

I'm hoping the self-clean cycle on the Oasis works out or this one will be going back.

[cameraman]

I always thought that was probably the best solution but we have two cats. They would have ended up in the washer, no doubt in my mind. :laugh: Uh oh. Didn't think of that...

[G.]

I always thought that was probably the best solution but we have two cats. They would have ended up in the washer, no doubt in my mind. :laugh:
Is there a downside to this blog?






:p

I'll take a look at my brands tonight. No issues. Everything works. Gloss Black, you stainless jackbillies!

Bosch dishwasher - only "issue" is the lack of drying element. The B doesn't have one, it's got a much better, more efficient method; blast super-heated H20 for final rinse. Convection currents pull the wet into a passive condensor. Works GREAT on ceramic/glassware, etc. Not so much on the hundreds of plastic kids cups, plates, bowls.

Fridge - forget brandname. Went to Home Depot, applied for a credit card I'll never use again, got the biggest MFing top freeze unit in existence (don't like side-by-side at all.). Sweet! Ten % off with crappy credit card. The deal beat anyone else by FAR!

Stove/oven - 5 burner gas with convection oven, Braun hood nice one, but not overkill. Kenmore. Likey. Bought at Sears' high-end store, I forget what it's called. Foo-Foo Hi End Sears Crap, or something like that.

http://s7.sears.com/is/image/Sears/02271389000?qlt=90,0&resMode=sharp&op_usm=0.9,0.5,0,0


Washer and dryer bought before front loaders became available. Wife overloads the washer sometimes, and the bungie cords stabilizing the drum pop off occasionally.

ETA: Fridge is a GE, Bosch DW purchased at Sear Appliance, 1/2 price. A legitimate 1/2 retail price, not a "marketing" 1/2 off price. New upper-mid-range unit for $275, I think. Topline Bosch has a light that shines on the floor and useless cycles. We got next one.

[Dave99]

Oh, you just haven't lived until you've had to deal with a three year old POS Whirlpool water heater. :thumdown:

I'm this close >><< to rolling it down the freaking street. :saywhat:

[mapguy]

Oh, you just haven't lived until you've had to deal with a three year old POS Whirlpool water heater. :thumdown:

I'm this close >><< to rolling it down the freaking street. :saywhat:

Sears takes care of the warranty service calls on those POS's. made by American Water Heater. Absolutely the worst water heater I've seen. Cut your losses now. Get a Bradford-White.

[oddlycalm]

Things could always be worse, you could own a Maytag Neptune washer/dryer like I do. I will never, ever buy anything Maytag again.:flame: You couldn't anyway, it's nothing but a name badge, it doesn't really exist anymore. You got a lot less than you deserved and so did Maytag. :shakehead

The Maytag board put a bright young MBA in charge to steer them into the new century and he managed to deep six the company almost overnight. He did all the usual biz school stuff. First move was to lay off all the people in Newton, IA and Herrin, IL that knew how the make the product and move manufacturing to a slop shop on the Ohio - West Virginia border that was completely staffed by minimum wage temps. Quality went to hell on both the consumer and commercial equipment and within a couple years the company was for sale.

Maytag had done the right thing and invested heavily in state of the art manufacturing equipment all during the 1990's so that quality was as good as it had ever been right up until the day the prick outsourced it. They had a good workforce that turned out quality equipment for generations. I knew some really good people there and to see what happened to them and their customers was a sad episode. :thumdown:

oc

[Sean Malone]

Update: spent another hour on the phone with Sears to ask for a status of the unit exchanges (they told me to expect a phone call from their scheduling department with 24 hours. This was last Sunday...no call came). Total of apprx 5 hours on the phone with them so far. Progress is being made, after being told that the fridge and dishwasher would be delivered on two different days to which I said "BS", they are scheduled to exchange both units this Saturday.
I also had a break-through with the dishwasher cleaning problem; I was researching the issue online (they have the internet on computers now), and found a page that described my issue of hardened soap scum on everything. The Sears dishwasher technician told me that we were using too much soap. “Use less soap” he said. End of story, user error bye-bye.
Well, the webpage I found said that if you live in an area that has hard water you need to fill both soap dispensers completely full. I did this and presto! Problem solved. The page also mentioned making sure you have enough water pressure and water temperature (which doesn’t really apply to this machine do to the pre-heater). But I did both, the tech did not.
The fridge is OK, not great but OK. I have it on its coldest setting and my wife complains it’s not cold enough. The 14 year old Whiprpool in the garage is colder. We’ll see what the new one is like on Saturday.

[Andrew Longman]

They had a good workforce that turned out quality equipment for generations. I knew some really good people there and to see what happened to them and their customers was a sad episode. :thumdown:

oc

Even more so they had continually optimized their machine designs. The bacic Type I Washer and dryer design went unchanged for decades, but was continually tweeked (today we would call it Kaisan style) to be nearly bulletproof and easily repaired. Your whizkid pal also led the charge to take cost out while building in obsolesence/planned failures.

[oddlycalm]

I was hoping that it was as advertised; the best Kenmore model they offered. I'm extremely disappointed with the dishwasher, and I had high hopes for that unit as it does have all the bells and whistles, not just a $100 stainless steel fascia. Wasn't meaning to direct my comment at you Sean. You have every right to expect the Kenmore Pro series to work reliably. There are zero excuses for a service organization that isn't able to red flag a problem installation and take steps to resolve it. Tech support software exists that has integrated dispatch modules. Companies can track every customer contact and everyone in their organization can share the current status in real time.

Not defending Sears, but I'm guessing the fundamental reshuffling of the industry has probably left them with far fewer options for sourcing their appliances, particularly if they want to stick with domestic producers. Still, that's their problem and it's their job to make certain it doesn't become your problem.

My big complaint with consumer appliances is that embedded controllers have led to a proliferation of mostly meaningless features. We are downsizing into a house that has top of the line Frigidaire (aka Electrolux) appliances and the number of features is only eclipsed by the number of controls. The manuals actually have to be consulted to use the silly things. Meaningless complexity instead of elegant longevity IMO.

oc

[Sean Malone]

Wasn't meaning to direct my comment at you Sean. You have every right to expect the Kenmore Pro series to work reliably. There are zero excuses for a service organization that isn't able to red flag a problem installation and take steps to resolve it. Tech support software exists that has integrated dispatch modules. Companies can track every customer contact and everyone in their organization can share the current status in real time.

Not defending Sears, but I'm guessing the fundamental reshuffling of the industry has probably left them with far fewer options for sourcing their appliances, particularly if they want to stick with domestic producers. Still, that's their problem and it's their job to make certain it doesn't become your problem.

My big complaint with consumer appliances is that embedded controllers have led to a proliferation of mostly meaningless features. We are downsizing into a house that has top of the line Frigidaire (aka Electrolux) appliances and the number of features is only eclipsed by the number of controls. The manuals actually have to be consulted to use the silly things. Meaningless complexity instead of elegant longevity IMO.

oc

Poignant, as always oc. I'll deal with it, just like I deal with all of life's big and little nuances. But the thing that gets me is that I'm the 'nice guy'. I go out of my way to keep a level head with the CSR's. I simply want an exchange, not a refund of my $8k or whatever the total is. I wonder if I'm playin' the wrong game here, but my pop plays the mean guy and I just think you can catch more bees with honey or whatever that saying is. It's frustrating and it's nice to vent. Oh, and one more thing, its the system, not the people that I found so frustrating. I just hope I got some decent equipment. I'm nervous.

[oddlycalm]

I just hope I got some decent equipment. I'm nervous. If it turns real bad just call the credit card company and contest the billing. That always gets their attention.

oc