Mosley wants common engine to cut costs

[ilferrari]

Renault is the only team that currently supports FIA President Max Mosley's proposal for a common engine in F1.

Mosley's suggestion has been a major subject of discussion in the latest meetings of the Formula One Teams' Association (FOTA), according to Auto Motor und Sport.

http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/080927225501.shtml

[Andrew Longman]

Why can't Mosley just forget the safe word?

I imagine the single engine would have to be a Ferrari, no?

[Robstar]

It woild have to be a customer motor of some description... The Nazi's gotta go... :thumdown:

Wasn't it his idea initially?

[Insomniac]

I'd just like to know who is crying about money? Stick to making rules, not limiting competition.

[stroker]

And the point then of F1 would be....?

[Accipiter]

Oh, just die!

[Methanolandbrats]

And the point then of F1 would be....? It would be the pinnacle of spec racing.

[miatanut]

News flash!
Make the engines spec. and they just spend the same money somewhere else, where it makes a smaller difference, BECAUSE THEY CAN!

Option B:
Open the rules up hugely, see cars which have different performance envelopes, make a more interesting technological display and more interesting racing.

Tough choice!

[DagoFast]

:Yawn. Who cares what engines are being used when some random race stewards decide who wins anyway.

F1 has jumped the shark.

[emjaya]

http://www.formula1.com/news/technical/2008/801/590.html

You can not copy what you can not see.

An spec engine will just allow more money to be spent coping what everybody else is doing, aerowise.

If F1 wants to save money, have spec side pods, front and rear wing and ban all the aero crap in between. :rolleyes:

[extramundane]

I would wish for someone to coat Max in gravy and lock him in a room with a starving timberwolf high on PCP, but the bastard would probably enjoy that too much.

[nissan gtp]

he can't be gone soon enough

[TrueBrit]

Methinks Max needs another caning....the whole point of F-1 is you build it ALL you moron...

[oddlycalm]

The FIA getting it's own house in order and doing a decent job of administration would be a nice change of pace if Max is looking for something to do. :irked: Solidly professional race stewards would be a nice place to start instead of using the job as a way to repay cronies for favors.

The best way to save money would be a rule change moratorium until one month after Max is deceased.

oc

[EDwardo]

Why can't Mosley just forget the safe word?

I imagine the single engine would have to be a Ferrari, no?


Nope. It MUST be Honda. :rofl:

[ilferrari]

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71205


The WMSC also agreed to give FIA president Max Mosley the authority to deal with the Formula One Teams Association (FOTA) for the introduction of "radical measures to achieve a substantial reduction of costs in the championship from 2010."

"Failing agreement with FOTA, the FIA will enforce the necessary measures to achieve this goal," said the FIA in a statement.

"It was further unanimously agreed to allow Formula One teams to equalise engine performance across the field for 2009, pending the introduction of cost-saving measures from 2010," it added.

:rolleyes:

[Indy]

F1 is dead.

[ilferrari]

Whoa, looks like this is for real:

FIA announces standard engine tender (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71456)

[Elmo T]

Time to revisit the jump the shark thread... :shakehead

[Rogue Leader]

You can't even make this **** up... Unbelieveable!

[Boatdesigner]

All they need is a standard chassis and they'll be Champ Car!:rofl:

[Methanolandbrats]

All they need is a standard chassis and they'll be Champ Car!:rofl:
Complete with ****y street races. Would'nt the cheapest way to save money be to freeze everything for next year and see what shakes out? Just wondering.

[STD]

^ Hey, your thinking! F1 management hasn't wanted fans that think too much in the last decade. Kind of undermines the brain trust...
Remember next year's party is all about KERS and going Green. :rofl:

[Insomniac]

Because more emphasis on aero is what the sport needs and where it should spend money. :rolleyes:

[cameraman]

McLaren F1 CEO Martin Whitmarsh said about the effect of a standard engine: "It does have a pretty big impact on Formula One – I imagine it would lead to quite a few of the engine manufacturers leaving the sport."

All but one I'd venture to guess:rolleyes:

:saywhat:

:flame:

[NismoZ]

Yeah, but Bernie sez they'll stay because he is saving them so much money.:rolleyes:

[Gnam]

Could be a negotiating tactic, a way to threaten the engine manufacturers into accepting any changes FOM wants.

[opinionated ow]

Could be a negotiating tactic, a way to threaten the engine manufacturers into accepting any changes FOM wants.

Anyone up for bringing back capital punishment for those two and their henchmen?

[Cam]

If this goes thru I am gone from F1. After all these years watching and attending I will simply not GAF. DIAF Max. :flame:

[Methanolandbrats]

I think Max and the Evil Little Prick have lost their minds. The whole point of Formula One is constructing the car and racing it on natural terrain road courses. Now we might have spec racers on street tracks. :saywhat: Perhaps they don't care about the past because they still will bank big dollars staging fabulous events in the middle east and far east.

[Indy]

Their stupidity should equal great opportunity for a real American series. Too bad we don't have one.

[cameraman]

Their stupidity should equal great opportunity for a real American series. Too bad we don't have one.

We do, it is called the ALMS.

[RusH]

We do, it is called the ALMS.

rwak on :thumbup:

[emjaya]

Ok, now this is just getting ridiculous...

http://www.formula1.com/news/headlines/2008/10/8546.html


Formula One racing’s governing body, the FIA, has invited tenders for a third party supplier of engines and transmission systems to be used by competitors in the 2010, 2011 and 2012 world championships.

However, existing teams and engine suppliers could still be allowed to build their own engines, providing they are to the same standardised design specified by the third party supplier.

:saywhat:

[NismoZ]

Cosworth? KK finally gets to F-1!

[opinionated ow]

All they need is a standard chassis and they'll be Champ Car!:rofl:

and reason to lose faith in all motorsport.

[chop456]

I think Max and the Evil Little Prick have lost their minds. The whole point of Formula One is constructing the car and racing it on natural terrain road courses.

Bah. What do you know, luddite? :tony:

[STD]

:saywhat:
:rofl::rofl::rofl:

[Methanolandbrats]

Bah. What do you know, luddite? :tony: Ya I know, I'm sure you would love nothing more than to jet to Singapore and drink champagne overlooking a tight, well lit corner as spec racers pound around it in single file at 50 mph. :D

[NismoZ]

No way! They're doin' at least 55!

[ilferrari]

Team bosses pull out of Mosley's Geneva summit (http://en.f1-live.com/f1/en/headlines/news/detail/081020092005.shtml)

God only knows what Mosley's response will be. :D

[STD]

Caution, uniter at work. :laugh:

[oddlycalm]

Agreement reached (http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/71638)


- Engine life will be increased from two to three races from 2009

- Manufacturers must be prepared to make 25 engine units available, at a cost of 10 million Euros, to customer teams

- There will be a further meeting between FOTA members in Brazil to determine testing kilometre limits for 2009, and an agreement in principal on the introduction of a standard Kinetic Energy Recovery System (KERS) unit for 2010 or 2011. KERS is believed to remain open for teams to use next season.

- The sport's governing body and FOTA will meet again after the Brazilian Grand Prix to discuss measures to reduce costs related to chassis development and the continuation of the use of customer chassis in the future.


Usual Max crap. Talk big then settle for something close to rational. A common KERS unit was probably inevitable though they should have just scrapped it IMO if they are serious about costs.

oc

[Gnam]

Were the teams against customer cars & engines for privateers? Was it necessary for Max to threaten them before they would accept it?

My impression was Minardi and Jordan were the ones complaining about Super Aguri and Toro Rosso.

[Insomniac]

I have a feeling that a lot of people will now be on board. :D


Ferrari will review its participation in Formula One if plans to introduce a standard engine for all teams from 2010 goes ahead, its board said in a statement on Monday.

Formula One's governing body, the International Automobile Federation (FIA), said earlier this month it intended to bring in the rule to save costs.

"The board of Ferrari, confirming its full support for the substantial and necessary reduction in costs starting with engines, has however expressed strong reservations about the project to equalize or standardize engines," the statement said.

"The board reserves the right to consider, together with our partners, our presence in this discipline," it said.
http://sports.espn.go.com/rpm/racing/f1/news/story?id=3667116

[NismoZ]

Ferrari to ICS in '011!:tony:

[oddlycalm]

Toyota is saying they will walk as well. Good luck Max, I hope you take one in the forhead...

oc

[Methanolandbrats]

ALMS, ALMS, ALMS....

[ilferrari]

The teams will spend what they can to win, that's the nature of the business. It's up to them to spend within their means. If Max stops them spending their money on engine R&D they will spend it on KERS or something else.

There is enough scope to make it easier for the smaller teams by adjusting the distribution of TV revenues and prize-money. The teams don't even get 50% of the TV revenues, the rest goes in Ecclestone's and the FIA's coffers. The big teams would still get more sponsor and prize money.

[Chaos]

I find it interesting that customer engines must be available, but customer chassis are taboo.

[patski]

Crazy, Just crazy!

[emjaya]

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,24569463-23770,00.html


FORMULA One's ruling body FIA moved to allay Ferrari's fears that they were going to impose standardised engines on all the stables for the 2010 season.

It seems the Ferrari Board were misinformed,'' read the statement.

“The FIA has offered the teams three options, one of which is the so-called standard engine, and another that the manufacturers should jointly guarantee to supply power trains to the independent teams for less than 5million euros per season.''

[Methanolandbrats]

http://www.foxsports.com.au/story/0,8659,24569463-23770,00.htmlWTF does that mean? You can either buy standard engines for your own use or agree to build and use standard engines and sell them at a loss. :saywhat:

[opinionated ow]

This is a particularly well writen editorial on the subject:
http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns20926.html

[Insomniac]

WTF does that mean? You can either buy standard engines for your own use or agree to build and use standard engines and sell them at a loss. :saywhat:

Yup. Build the engine to the supplied schematic (gives you quality control I guess) and make them available to others or buy your engine from someone else. I doubt Ferrari misunderstood them. It's the designing, not manufacturing they care about.

[oddlycalm]

This is a particularly well writen editorial on the subject:
http://www.grandprix.com/ns/ns20926.html


A glorified version of GP2 will not get fans climbing trees at the Autodromo Nazionale at Monza.

That pretty much says it all IMO.

oc

[G.]

It's Cosworth.

WTF


Alternatively teams can build their own engines to the same standard design or continue to use their current engines, with some restrictions. In either case, the Xtrac/Ricardo gearbox would have to be used.


“We have completed the tendering process and are now in exclusive negotiations with Cosworth together with Xtrac and Ricardo Transmissions (XR) to supply a complete Formula 1 powertrain starting in 2010. The engine will be a current Formula 1 engine while the transmission will be state-of-the-art Formula 1 and a joint effort by two companies which already supply transmissions to most of the grid.



wtf (http://formula-one.speedtv.com/article/f1-mosley-offers-teams-standard-cosworth-engine-deal/)

[KLang]

Do KK and Forsythe still own Cosworth? If so they stand to make a few bucks back to cover their ChampCar losses.

[NismoZ]

They most certainly do. (I wish I could have seen this one coming, say in my post of 10/18. :))

[pchall]

“The FIA has offered the teams three options, one of which is the so-called standard engine, and another that the manufacturers should jointly guarantee to supply power trains to the independent teams for less than 5million euros per season.''

What's the third option? Withdraw from F1?

[SteveH]

What's the third option? Withdraw from F1?

The third option is only available to Ferrari. ;) :D

[SurfaceUnits]

3) build your own engine to specs not to exceed the performance of the standard engine

[:gomer:] ONced again TOney is ahead of everbody elest waitin fort hem to catch up [/:gomer:]

[High Sided]

1. buy the engine at Cosworth

2. build your own engine but with the technical specs supplied by Cosworth

3. the right to continue to use a team's existing engine, with the current ban on development and requirement for engine parity still in place (noting that the engine supplied will become the reference engine for output and other performance indicators and no engine will be permitted to exceed those indicators).

http://f1.gpupdate.net/en/news/2008/12/05/cosworth-to-supply-f1-with-standard-engines/

[NismoZ]

Sheesh, no wonder KK wanted to get those 93 engines back from himself. Just plug 'em in to F-1 and EVERYbody saves a bundle. What are they talkin', 14k rpm? Piece o' cake! I wouldn't object to the exhaust note either!

[pchall]

All three options reduce F1 to scheisse.

[NismoZ]

C'mon, so it ISN'T your father's Oldsmobile...oh, wait a second:(

[oddlycalm]

All three options reduce F1 to scheisse.

Don't forget the new aero oogly wings when you calculate that fecal factor...

oc

[Methanolandbrats]

Everyone in F1 would rather keep the five star hotels, the absurd temporary palaces, the caviar, the private jets, the yachts, the expensive Nazi whores and all the other crap while they sacrifice the roots of the sport......sound familiar? :yuck: