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SurfaceUnits
11-06-09, 10:19 PM
GM releases details on upcoming 4.5L Duramax turbo-diesel V8

The battle of the diesel-powered half-tons is about to begin, and today General Motors revealed more details on its entrant: the 4.5L Duramax turbo-diesel V8. Thanks to a narrow-angle V block, the 4.5L turbo diesel will fit in the same space as the General's small-block V8, which does give us hope for additional applications beyond just its half-ton trucks. Large SUVs are surely going to get the engine as an option eventually, but maybe GM can find a passenger car or two down the line that would benefit from the tons of torque this engine will produce.

GM says the 4.5L turbo-diesel will produce 310 horsepower and 520 pound-feet of torque, while bumping fuel efficiency by 25%. In order to help it meet Bin 5 and LEV 2 emissions standards as well as be 50-state legal, the engine will feature both a diesel particular filter and NOx after-treatment system that uses urea to knock out those pesky nitrogen-based particles.

Another engineering coup for the 4.5L turbo-diesel is that GM has reduced its parts count thanks to a design that includes integrated aluminum cylinder head exhaust manifolds and an integral cam cover intake manifold. You'll be able to buy the new diesel in model year 2010 Chevy Silverados and GMC Sierra half-ton pickups, no doubt for a sizable premium over their gas-powered counterparts.

PRESS RELEASE

GM READYING V-8 DIESEL FOR 2010 MODEL YEAR NORTH AMERICAN LIGHT DUTY TRUCKS

* Scheduled for GM pickup trucks under 8,500 pounds Gross Vehicle Weight
* Low emissions, high performance and excellent fuel economy

PONTIAC, Mich. - General Motors Corp.'s revolutionary new 4.5L V-8 Duramax turbo-diesel, which makes its debut in Chevrolet Silverado and GMC Sierra light duty trucks in the 2010 model year, is compact, powerful and fuel-efficient. The engine also is lighter, an important consideration in the competitive light truck market, because it was designed with more than 70 fewer parts.

The new dual-overhead cam, four-valve V-8 diesel engine boasts a number of innovative design approaches that have enabled its compact size and mass, including integral aluminum cylinder head exhaust manifolds, integral cam cover intake manifolds and a narrow V-angle block. The new V-8's compact size enables it to fit within the same space of a small-block V-8 gasoline engine and offers GM the flexibility to introduce it in a wide variety of vehicles to meet market demand.

The new 4.5L V-8 diesel is expected to deliver more than 310 horsepower (231 kW) and 520 lb-ft of torque (705 Nm), while delivering a 25-percent engine fuel efficiency improvement versus comparable gasoline engines.

"This premium diesel engine is expected to deliver the power, torque and refinement our customers expect," said Tom Stephens, executive vice president, GM Global Powertrain and Global Quality.

The new V-8 diesel will be GM's first engine to use a selective catalytic reduction (SCR) NOx after-treatment system with a diesel particulate filter to help achieve Tier 2 Bin 5 and LEV 2 emissions, making it compliant in all 50 states. SCR was chosen for its proven NOx reduction capability and durability, and high efficiency while operating in optimal diesel combustion modes, making it a very attractive system to achieve high fuel economy.

The environmental benefits of the new engine include a 13-percent reduction in CO2 emissions and at least a 90-percent reduction in particulates and NOx compared to many diesel vehicles today.

Technical highlights

Robust and innovative, the new 4.5L diesel V-8's technical details include lightweight aluminum cylinder heads with integrated manifolding; a variable-vane turbocharger with intercooling; a compacted graphite iron (CGI) cylinder block for a stronger and lighter base engine (compared to lower-strength aluminum or heavier grey cast iron); and a fracture-split main bearing cap system. GM has applied for patents on a number of these features and expects to have several patents granted before the engine launches.

Compared to typical production diesel engines, GM's new 4.5L V-8 turbo-diesel innovatively reverses the flow of air and exhaust gases entering and exiting the cylinder heads. Air enters the engine through ports in the top portion of each cylinder head. Exhaust gases exit inward between the cylinder heads and directly into a turbocharger.

"By using integral cylinder head exhaust manifolds, integral cam cover intake manifolds and a narrow cylinder block, designers saved space and reduced the engine's weight. And because the engine makes more efficient use of heat, fuel economy and performance are enhanced, and noise and emissions are reduced," said Gary Arvan, chief engineer for the 4.5L V-8 diesel.

An electronically controlled, 29,000-psi (2,000 bar) common-rail fuel system is also used on the engine. It has the ability to inject fuel five times per combustion event, reducing noise and emissions while enhancing fuel economy.

"This new V-8 diesel meets the toughest emissions requirements in North America, and it also delivers an effortless performance feel because of its high torque across the speed range," said Charlie Freese, executive director of GM Powertrain Diesel Engineering. "It is also significantly quieter than many other diesels on the road today, with noise and vibration performance approaching gasoline V-8 levels.

oddlycalm
11-06-09, 10:56 PM
I don't get it. Why cut and paste this blog that basically cut and pasted the GM press release from May 2008 on the Isuzu-GM diesel without comment?
May 08 blog (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/05/05/gm-releases-details-on-upcoming-4-5l-duramax-turbo-diesel-v8/)

oc

Indy
11-07-09, 01:44 AM
If they would simply copy the 50 MPG VW TDI engine and make it plentiful and cheap in a small car, they would sell more than they can imagine.

oddlycalm
11-07-09, 02:41 AM
If they would simply copy the 50 MPG VW TDI engine and make it plentiful and cheap in a small car, they would sell more than they can imagine.
The convention wisdom is that US car drivers won't buy diesels because the they think they will be smelly and noisy like the crude blunderbuss diesels sold in pickups over the last 20yrs. It's a classic cart and horse situation. Good for VW if they are there first with the goods.

I knew it was the right answer when I first drove a Benz 300SD turbodiesel in 1980 during the oil crunch of that period. While it was crude, and pathetically underpowered by today's diesel standard, it could haul a full size 4500lb. Benz with three large men in it up a 6% grade at 65mh without downshifting and it was compact 3.0L I5 engine that would fit in smaller cars. The turbo not only gave it acceptable power but it killed some of the noise as well.

oc

Indy
11-07-09, 09:30 AM
The problem is that the new Golf TDI, their smallest and least expensive car in the U.S., is still going to be hard to get and priced over $25,000. GM needs to put an engine like that in a Chevy Cobalt that sells under $20,000.

I seem to remember in the 1980's a friend having a diesel Civic and saying it was the best car ever made. That thing ran forever and got great mileage. It is not like the technology is not out there to get this done. It is just the boneheadedness of the US manufacturers and their unwillingness to design a decent small car.

SteveH
11-07-09, 09:33 AM
I seem to remember in the 1980's a friend having a diesel Civic and saying it was the best car ever made. That thing ran forever and got great mileage.

I'm curious, when did Honda quit affering that car? And why?

Sounds like a perfect solution for today's market.

SurfaceUnits
11-07-09, 10:04 AM
I don't get it. Why cut and paste this blog that basically cut and pasted the GM press release from May 2008 on the Isuzu-GM diesel without comment?
May 08 blog (http://www.autoblog.com/2008/05/05/gm-releases-details-on-upcoming-4-5l-duramax-turbo-diesel-v8/)

oc

because that is what this thing called the interweb is for, gathering bits of data that coalesce into an informational whole so that one does not need to click 15 times to get the whole repository. But some people feel it is necessary to cut and paste the URL to something that was cut and pasted instead of just getting to the freaking point of the matter.

the title is the commentary

oddlycalm
11-07-09, 03:15 PM
the title is the commentary
Fair enough. I agree, the design is interesting but after three years of press releases, video presentations and hype they said never mind.

Duramax 4.5L shelved (http://wardsauto.com/ar/duramax_ready_stephens_090715/)

oc

cameraman
11-07-09, 03:25 PM
HE shoots, he scores...
:rofl:

miatanut
11-07-09, 05:35 PM
How about the Ilmor five stroke?
http://www.ilmor.co.uk/concept_5-stroke_1.php

A lot more potential, in my opinion.

oddlycalm
11-07-09, 06:14 PM
How about the Ilmor five stroke?
http://www.ilmor.co.uk/concept_5-stroke_1.php

A lot more potential, in my opinion.
Not close to production but an interesting concept. Especially if combined with camless valve actuation for an addition 10% gain in efficiency.

A lot could be done to increase gasoline engine efficiency but it won't be because the companies management teams believe hydrogen fuel cells and electric cars are the answer. Meanwhile we're stuck with the status quo.

I'm disappointed that the high tech diesels available everywhere aren't coming to the US in meaningful volume because of conventional marketing "wisdom" and that companies that have them ready to have pulled back. We could be seeing real energy savings right now instead of "some day." Hell, we could have been seeing it since 1980. :irked:

oc

Indy
11-07-09, 07:43 PM
I'm curious, when did Honda quit affering that car? And why?

Sounds like a perfect solution for today's market.

I just did a quick google search and it appears that Honda makes diesels for other countries, just not for the U.S. :shakehead

miatanut
11-07-09, 08:18 PM
Not close to production but an interesting concept. Especially if combined with camless valve actuation for an addition 10% gain in efficiency.

A lot could be done to increase gasoline engine efficiency but it won't be because the companies management teams believe hydrogen fuel cells and electric cars are the answer. Meanwhile we're stuck with the status quo.

I'm disappointed that the high tech diesels available everywhere aren't coming to the US in meaningful volume because of conventional marketing "wisdom" and that companies that have them ready to have pulled back. We could be seeing real energy savings right now instead of "some day." Hell, we could have been seeing it since 1980. :irked:

oc
For years I've been wondering why valves weren't activated by solenoids, where you could have precise control over valve timing to go with the improvement electronic engine management has given on fuel metering and ignition timing. Finally somebody is looking into it.

Hydrogen fuel cells will be the solution eventually, but there are other technologies which could provide a more immediate return.

oddlycalm
11-07-09, 10:54 PM
For years I've been wondering why valves weren't activated by solenoids, where you could have precise control over valve timing to go with the improvement electronic engine management has given on fuel metering and ignition timing. Finally somebody is looking into it.

Yeah, I'm with you on the wondering part. Camshafts seem like an automotive prehensile tail. :laugh: Since Renault introduced pneumatic valve trains to F1 in the early 80's it's seemed so obvious and clear. Having watched all the mechanical and hydraulic kluges to achieve variable valve timing over the years (Honda, BMW, etc) I couldn't understand why they bothered with cams at all. Fetish?

Navistar is using a hydraulic camless system supplied by Valeo on it's small diesels and plans to transition away from cams entirely. Whether cartridge check valves, pneumatics or linear actuators (fancied up solenoids) the benefits are the same; infinitely variable valve timing and lift, less weight, lower parasitic losses, lower parts count, no need for a separate exhaust brake in diesels, etc., etc. People wouldn't even know they were gone.

oc

extramundane
11-07-09, 11:01 PM
I just did a quick google search and it appears that Honda makes diesels for other countries, just not for the U.S. :shakehead

At some point in the last year, Honda specifically stated that they were canceling plans to sell diesels in the US and instead focusing on hybrid technology for its non-standard powertrains.

SurfaceUnits
11-08-09, 10:46 AM
Honda completes new diesel engine plant, U.S. still doesn't get them
by Sam Abuelsamid (RSS feed) on Apr 24th 2009 at 6:00PM

Honda still doesn't plan to offer American drivers the opportunity to buy its diesel engines, even as premium Acuras. Nonetheless, the automaker has just completed construction of a new factory in Ogawa, Japan to produce blocks and other castings for its four-cylinder diesel engines. The machining equipment is now being installed and and production of components is expected to begin in the fall. Not only are the engines efficient in operation, but Honda has also designed the new plant to reduce CO2 emissions from the casting operations by 40 percent and 25 percent from the machining lines.

The diesel engines are installed into Japanese-built Accords for the European market (twin to our Acura TSX) as well as being shipped to England for installation into CR-Vs and Civics. It's a shame that we won't get a chance to try out this engine here anytime soon, because Americans would likely appreciate the 40+ mpg efficiency and high torque characteristics of these engines.

http://green.autoblog.com/2009/04/24/honda-completes-new-diesel-engine-plant-us-still-doesnt-get-th/


Americans would likely appreciate the 40+ mpg efficiency and high torque characteristics of these engines. apparently not.

oddlycalm
11-08-09, 06:11 PM
apparently not.
Exactly. This makes no sense to me anyone. The comments on the article tell the story.

oc

JohnHKart
11-09-09, 07:39 PM
The problem is that the new Golf TDI, their smallest and least expensive car in the U.S., is still going to be hard to get and priced over $25,000. GM needs to put an engine like that in a Chevy Cobalt that sells under $20,000.

I seem to remember in the 1980's a friend having a diesel Civic and saying it was the best car ever made. That thing ran forever and got great mileage. It is not like the technology is not out there to get this done. It is just the boneheadedness of the US manufacturers and their unwillingness to design a decent small car.


Yup. I think my VW love affair with the idea of buying one is over. Just too many stories of bad customer service, multi thousand dollar repairs and parts...I just can't do it. I guess it's just going to be trips to Germany that I drive those cars. Hope is on for the new Euro spec Focus and Fiestas that are coming next year. Meanwhile, the newly rebuilt motored 93 Escort just keeps going (500 miles last weekend). I want to keep it for gigs only and get a small hatchback for everything else. (It has to be a hatchback- so cars like the Cobalt are out). At 6 4 I can't fit most of the cars I research anyway, less legroom than a 93 Escort. Damn midgets! ;)

Ankf00
11-09-09, 10:23 PM
design and consumer products is a massive american industry, we may not be Copenhagen, but it absolutely baffles me how we can have the big 3, and we can have globally relevant firms like IDEO...


yet the two never meet, even on a simple philosophical level. Cars = consumer f'ing products. "people like mileage, diesels gives them mileage, lets give them mileage, lets give them diesels!" :irked:

chop456
07-23-11, 10:26 AM
GM CEO Confirms 2013 Chevy Cruze Diesel For U.S (http://www.greencarreports.com/news/1063651_gm-ceo-confirms-2013-chevy-cruze-diesel-for-u-s-report)

w00t! :thumbup:

Now make a 5-door.

NismoZ
07-23-11, 03:15 PM
Well then, JohnH...perhaps you might want to research Mazda's new Skyactiv technology in the Mazda3 hatch or the new (Spring 2012) CX-5 crossover. The 2.0 gas is to deliver more power and more torque than the current 2.5, with 40 mpg, and a 2.2 litre 173 hp two stage turbo diesel (with even better mpg?) WILL be introduced in Europe at about the same time. Start demanding it here...now!:)