View Full Version : NASCAR common templates: In Your Opinion
WickerBill
06-03-03, 12:29 PM
Are this year's common templates increasing or decreasing your interest in the sport of NASCAR?
Do you think the templates make the drivers with more talent stand out, or is it the same as it was in the past -- a dog in a Roush car will whip the best driver in a BAM car?
I'm interested because I would imagine those who are strongly tied to the "manufacturer battle" are less interested, and those who just like to watch drivers compete are more interested.
racer2c
06-03-03, 12:45 PM
Personally, I've always looked at NASCAR as a battle of the engine makes instead of body makes. It's been two decades since they actually used a 'production' shell anyway.
I watched the 87th Indy and the Coke 600 thereafter and thought that, as mediocre a race as Indy was this year, it was head and shoulders more "entertaining" than the 600. A cause of common templates? Who can say.
devilmaster
06-03-03, 12:49 PM
I don't think the common template has really changed anything.
For the most part, A diehard fan from the previous years should have realized that the only stock parts on the car would have been the hood and roof, iirc.
It hasn't really made a dent in the actual racing IMO, as the song remains the same. Roush, Hendrick, DEI are still at the front of the pack....
All the common template stopped was the constant bickering between manu. (they still bicker somewhat) and gave their tech guys less templates to work with.
On a personal level, I haven't been into NASCAR much this year, but I attribute that to the fact that I haven't gone to a race yet. Get back to me in a month, (as Michigan is in June)....
Steve
I guess one thing I like about the common template is that we don't have to hear the constant bitching from the manufacturers.
I would be a much bigger Nascar fan if two things would happen.
1. Stop racing back to the yellow. This is the dumbest rule in all of motorsports IMO.
2. Let the manufacturers compete. If one chassis is better than the other then tough luck. Don't change the rules to try to make it even.
Sean O'Gorman
06-03-03, 12:59 PM
It hasn't changed my interest at all. I think that accuracy as far as bodywork should be either all the way, or not at all. Since none of the cars really resemble the street versions anyway, I guess it makes sense for identical templates.
RaceChic
06-03-03, 01:04 PM
It hasn't changed my interest at all..... I was never interested. :D
racer2c
06-03-03, 01:05 PM
I forgot to add...if it eliminates the in season rule manipulation from one make to another, I'm for it and it would increase my level of interest in NASCAR. I always thought it unfair, amateurish and farcical to 'give' a Chevy another quarter inch only to have Ford whine and cry for two months as the Chevy's mop the floor up, then NASCAR would take it back and Chevy would cry (and lose). This contributed to my opinion of the mafioso style decision making coming from NASCAR.
I started losing interest in NASCAR back around the time that the Lumina was introduced. By massaging that car to get it "NASCAR Ready" they opened the Pandora's box of Aerodynamic tweaking. Aero Matching is NASCAR's way of trying to stuff the genie back into the bottle. (Am I allowed to combine those metaphors? :p )
I started losing interest in NASCAR in the early 70s by which time they clamped down on the aero supercars, dropped 500 unit homologation rules, and eliminated all the special engines. By the mid to late 80s there was nothing left.
If NASCAR adopted something akin to DTM regulations and did more road racing I'd have to take a closer look.
Fat chance of that, though.
The managed competition dropped my interest as it became worse, then the Dale Earnhardt thing reduced my interest to zero. Haven't watched a race all year, but I might watch the Sears Point race if I remember.
I decided to watch the last 12 races last year to watch Stewarts run for the championship. Sheer and utter boredom. How can anyone sit and watch cars circle a 1 mile track 400 times and not be semi-comatose when it's over.
I too lost interest in the late 80's. Taking the stock out of the stock cars made it rather dis-interesting. The cars they run today are about as inspirational as the Prototype class in Grand Am.
Quit following the sport with passion about the time Darrel Waltrip showed up. Then Earnhardt made Waltrip look like a good will ambassador with his "driving" style.
I do keep up with it from a passing interest. You have to in order to carry on a conversation with most folks! I dont golf, picket abortion clinics, so I keep up with the short attention span theater folks by keeping track of NASCAR through various media outlets
Ziggy
racer2c
06-03-03, 02:38 PM
Originally posted by Ziggy
I do keep up with it from a passing interest. You have to in order to carry on a conversation with most folks! I dont golf, picket abortion clinics, so I keep up with the short attention span theater folks by keeping track of NASCAR through various media outlets
Ziggy
For me it was the sight of the winged warriors in the early '70's as a kid.
If you live in America and follow racing of any type, you know NASCAR. It's forced down your throat. I constantly complain that I know more about NASCAR than friends of mine who say they 'follow' the sport. You know the types, a DEJr hat. A Tony Stewart decal on their car...they still ask me when "when is the race on this week?" I smile and say that the Champ Car race is on at 1:00 (queue blank stare). I don't want to start slamming the stock car fans, but let me just say that they are a very self centered group of fans.
Ziggy reminded me of another big turn-off point for me. It was about 5 years ago that Dale Earnhardt spun out Terry Labonte at Bristol (?), on the last lap, as Labonte was leading. Earnhardt went on to win the race.
I couldn't believe that Earnhardt was penalized for this, and it became clear to me that NASCAR racing wasn't a real sport.
Napoleon
06-03-03, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by pchall
I started losing interest in NASCAR in the early 70s by which time they clamped down on the aero supercars, dropped 500 unit homologation rules, and eliminated all the special engines. By the mid to late 80s there was nothing left.
That pretty much sums it up for me also.
Make/Margin/Lead Changes
Chevy Caution - 11
FORD .96 - 20
FORD 9.1 - 17
Chevy 1.23 - 23
Pontiac .002 - 15
FORD .39 - 11
Dodge 3.4 - 19
Chevy .125 - 43
Chevy Caution - 14
FORD 2.29 - 19
Chevy Caution - 20
Chevy Caution - 16
Dodge .834 - 16
Throw out the DEI plate races and one could easily say that the races have been better. Two drivers have won from the pole. But the season is still too long.
A number of close finishes
FRANKY,
That makes the bold assumption that quality of racing can be measured in lead changes and margin of victory.
One round of green flag pit stops can easily give you a half dozen lead changes, and the guy who was in front before the pit stops began will end up in the lead when everything works out. A convenient yellow could replace those 6 lead changes with 0 lead changes.
The same thing goes for margin of victory. If you have a yellow flag 10 laps from the end of the race, you're going to have a close finish. If you have a 50 lap green flag run, you probably won't.
Sure there are exceptions to the above, but those numbers alone won't tell you whether or not a race was fun to watch.
Uneven punishment and questionable calls like red flagging some races but giving the newest poster boy a win at the 600 (even though it stop raining) will always keep NASCAR from being embraced by die hards, then again, what would Chris Kneifel have done?
Originally posted by JoeBob
FRANKY,
That makes the bold assumption that quality of racing can be measured in lead changes and margin of victory.
One round of green flag pit stops can easily give you a half dozen lead changes, and the guy who was in front before the pit stops began will end up in the lead when everything works out. A convenient yellow could replace those 6 lead changes with 0 lead changes.
The same thing goes for margin of victory. If you have a yellow flag 10 laps from the end of the race, you're going to have a close finish. If you have a 50 lap green flag run, you probably won't.
Sure there are exceptions to the above, but those numbers alone won't tell you whether or not a race was fun to watch.
I was just throwing out numbers, the racing on TV has seemed better than previous years. NASCAR's 50th Anniversery with the Earnhardt rule aero was the worst seaon on record, this season has put the driver back in, if they followed Rusty Wallace's idea of getting softer tires it would be even better.
devilmaster
06-03-03, 04:21 PM
Originally posted by FRANKY
if they followed Rusty Wallace's idea of getting softer tires it would be even better.
NASCAR already has too many blown tires....
IMO, if Firestone/Bridgestone went NASCAR, expect GY to get their ass handed to them again.... (i know, i know, never happen in a million years)
Steve
eiregosod
06-04-03, 01:19 PM
Common template regulation?
That simply makes the cars as simply advertsing hoardings for manufacturers, pay up the $$$ to NASCAR and you can put your logos on the cars!
Although the cars are advertising hoardings, allowing each manufacturer to come up with their unique designs gives some sort of credibility!
I dont watch NASCAR anymore, I found the races in the mid-late 90s fun to watch, now it too has fallen prey to the single-file racing, and the over-over-commercialisiation of the sport just doesn't appeal to me now!
scanman
06-04-03, 04:38 PM
I'm with pchall on this one.....just a little earlier....
In 68 they gave consessions to chevy because of the ford fastback..
(I had one) (b!tch to clean that rear window)...It became clear they
wanted managed events, NOT races.....those were the glory days of
nascar for me....today...many people have stated nascar is like WWE
etc, I could care less.....the only time I watch is Watkins Glen and
Sear's Point. just to see Ron Fellows kick ***.....
ps....as a side note, I traded in the first 66 Mustang GT sold in Toronto
for that 68 ford fastback, (got married) couldn't hold a candle to
my 65 Galaxie that I only had for 12,00 miles....hey, I was young...:D
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