So does Bernard get fired?

[Spicoli]

Offered without comment...:gomer:

Super d seems to finally be getting it. Irl is the laughingstock of the motor racing world.:thumdown:

[Andrew Longman]

Thank you, sir! May I have another?

Baltimore officials aren't giving up on Grand Prix (http://www.baltimoresun.com/sports/auto-racing/baltimore-grand-prix/bs-md-grand-prix-books-follow-20111208,0,7944162.story)

:shakeheadWell, the ALMS schedule could sure use the date. Detroit and Austin already fell off the schedule.

And if someone can pick up all the stuff at 10c on the dollar, it might actually break even.

[SteveH]

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/article/indycar-2012-dallara-improving-on-ovals

[Methanolandbrats]

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/article/indycar-2012-dallara-improving-on-ovals

I readed that. Cliffs notes version: Hideous lump of **** understeers, oversteers and is slow, but we're working on it for the season opener. :rofl:

[SteveH]

And it is going to cost to fix it.

[opinionated ow]

Serious **** up. They should have just let it open. Let people buy the chassis they want that meets the rules and develop how they want it. None of this spec chassis/gearbox/driveline crap

[patski]

Serious **** up. They should have just let it open. Let people buy the chassis they want that meets the rules and develop how they want it. None of this spec chassis/gearbox/driveline crap

That would require using a brain!

[SurfaceUnits]

That would require giving up control

fixxered

[Andrew Longman]

That would require using a brain!Or just the ability to count to 33.

I seriously wonder if they will need to open things up just to get people to field a car.

Why would you buy this equipment and invest in this series?

[Chief]

Why would you buy this equipment and invest in this series?
newman Haas answered that..

[NismoZ]

Oh, how I wish a few OTHER teams would get a clue. SEEEE ya!:thumbup:

[SteveH]

Their sponsors might.

[NismoZ]

Oh, how I wish a few other sponsors AND teams would get a clue!:)

[Spicoli]

Just had a conversation with a first string gomer, talking way back into ims blueblood, and they are NOT pleased with 3 ovals. Accourse - STILL - none of this is tony's fault.

these people hate anything but ovals. AAA is what they yearn fer. :gomer:

[SurfaceUnits]

these people hate anything but ovals. AAA is what they yearn fer. :gomer:

I thought they loved Indy. They will be the first ones marched off to that FEMA concentration camp in Beech Grove

[SteveH]

IZOD requires 16 races, this should be interesting

http://www.indystar.com/article/20111210/SPORTS0107/112100338/Search-continues-fill-out-IndyCar-s-12-schedule

[Spicoli]

IZOD requires 16 races, this should be interesting

http://www.indystar.com/article/20111210/SPORTS0107/112100338/Search-continues-fill-out-IndyCar-s-12-schedule

He's got bigger trouble than he thinks.2 of those races are vaporware, China and Balteemore. So he's got to. Scramble to find potentially 4 more.

Whaddya bet they run the road course at Indy?

This thing is on life support, the Scheetz sammivh they deserve.

[SteveH]

And now we know why Texas stays on the schedule.

Accourse if there is a 'Vegas' moment during that race, IZOD may bolt regardless of the size of the schedule.

[Chief]

Here's the breakdown...after 15 years:

Indy 500 is the only race from the original IRL series.

6 ea. of the 2012 races were developed by the IRL, Iowa the sole oval, and only three of the six deemed "successful".

7 ea. of the 2012 races are CART/CCWS legacy events, which have drawn at times upward of 50% less fans since IRL took over.

Since 1996, the IRL has been tossed out of > 26 AOW racing markets, mostly ovals.

That's some evolution. :tony:

[Methanolandbrats]

Here's the breakdown...after 15 years:

Indy 500 is the only race from the original IRL series.

6 ea. of the 2012 races were developed by the IRL, Iowa the sole oval, and only three of the six deemed "successful".

7 ea. of the 2012 races are CART/CCWS legacy events, which have drawn at times upward of 50% less fans since IRL took over.

Since 1996, the IRL has been tossed out of > 26 AOW racing markets, mostly ovals.

That's some evolution. :tony:

More choices on tv, too many furriners, too much good weather and a lack of promotion by media partners are the real problems, not the product itself. :gomer:

[Spicoli]

Here's the breakdown...after 15 years:

Indy 500 is the only race from the original IRL series.

6 ea. of the 2012 races were developed by the IRL, Iowa the sole oval, and only three of the six deemed "successful".

7 ea. of the 2012 races are CART/CCWS legacy events, which have drawn at times upward of 50% less fans since IRL took over.

Since 1996, the IRL has been tossed out of > 26 AOW racing markets, mostly ovals.

That's some evolution. :tony:

Damn Chief, that's some damning evidence right thar. best sumbuddy post that up on the TrackForrumms.

ediotr's comment: Just so they have a fair shot at a response, yaknow.

[SteveH]

What's the odds on a twin 200 at IRP/Lucas Raceway? Smack dab in the middle of gomer nation.

[Rex Karz]

Does IRP have enough room under the stands so the fans can get out of the hot sunlight?

[BobN]

What's the odds on a twin 200 at IRP/Lucas Raceway? Smack dab in the middle of gomer nation.

I would guess zero since IMS stole their Nationwide event. IMS has screwed the fans, tv networks, car builders, other track owners and everything they have touched. The term "burned bridges" taken to its truest form.:D

[Al Czervik]

I would guess zero since IMS stole their Nationwide event. IMS has screwed the fans, tv networks, car builders, other track owners and everything they have touched. The term "burned bridges" taken to its truest form.:D

That's "starched earth" instead of burned bridges.

[SteveH]

And it's all CART's fault

[SurfaceUnits]

This ESPN.com article argues, and rightly so, that IndyCar is wrong to blame the Las Vegas Motor Speedway for Dan Wheldon's death. It could have happened at any 'pack' racing oval track facility. In fact we have seen many accidents in the IRL over the years that were just as horrific as what happened in Las Vegas. The problem is not so much the track as it is the 'pack' racing mentality that IndyCar had. We said for years they were going to kill someone and we just hoped they did not launch a car into the grandstands and kill 50 fans in one fell swoop.

another paid shill

IndyCar Series officials have assigned blame to the wrong thing. What they should do is look in the mirror.

The decision Thursday not to return to Las Vegas Motor Speedway is a mistake and won't solve the problem that caused Dan Wheldon's death at LVMS in October.

Blaming the track is like baking a cake with salt instead of sugar in it, then blaming the oven.

IndyCar needs high-speed ovals in big markets unless the series is content to become ...

http://espn.go.com/racing/indycar/story/_/id/7338205/indycar-leaving-ovals-hurt-indycar

[SurfaceUnits]

Here's the breakdown...after 15 years:

Indy 500 is the only race from the original IRL series.

6 ea. of the 2012 races were developed by the IRL, Iowa the sole oval, and only three of the six deemed "successful".

7 ea. of the 2012 races are CART/CCWS legacy events, which have drawn at times upward of 50% less fans since IRL took over.

Since 1996, the IRL has been tossed out of > 26 AOW racing markets, mostly ovals.

That's some evolution. :tony:
did C^RT race at Kentucky 5 or 6 times?:tony::gomer:

were you sober when you made that list? Texas

[Spicoli]

I have a question fer ya'll:

Perspective: So - the gomer pack racing, crashes are cool, indy-centric mentality has all but killed the sport. Whenever I "embrace" debate with these folks, i ask them how many IRL races they go to each year. the answer is usually - 1, Indy. It used to be maybe 2 others, KY or mebbe MI or ORD, but lately, its just been one. And even fewer of them even watch the other races. Their core crowd is dwindling rapidly.

>Funny, they still tell me shoemaker wins everything in f1, and there is no passing, and they are eurosnobs and they only have 6 cars in a race, and ferrari wins everything. its humorous.<

There are a few "true believers" but these are the lemming dignitary few, that are so far invested in the series, anything they do can be rationalized by "Evolution" and various other excuses like "too many entertainiment options", "its the economy", etc etc etc. I can't say there are mnore than a hundred of these people. IMS has screwed so many people in the industry, and Gasoline Alley - where are the shops are, etc, is a freaking Ghosdt Town these days. The early indy gomers, the original "all oval, all american" crowd is beyond pizzed, and when Tony left, most of them did too. So Josie had Tony fired, and now she and her sisters have the rodeo clown and that is all. They bet the farm on this move, and guess what? Survey sez they are about to loose it all. At some point, somebuddy is just going to yell "Uncle" and walk away. These "advisors" on the IMS/IRL board have got to be seeing red bleeding from the bottom line. As advisors they HAVE TO show them how fubar'd this thing is.

So when do we hit bottom? What is the move that finally stops this trainwreck and throw their hands up in the air, "We give up"!

[Lux Interior]

I have a question fer ya'll:

Perspective: So - the gomer pack racing, crashes are cool, indy-centric mentality has all but killed the sport. Whenever I "embrace" debate with these folks, i ask them how many IRL races they go to each year. the answer is usually - 1, Indy. It used to be maybe 2 others, KY or mebbe MI or ORD, but lately, its just been one. And even fewer of them even watch the other races. Their core crowd is dwindling rapidly.

>Funny, they still tell me shoemaker wins everything in f1, and there is no passing, and they are eurosnobs and they only have 6 cars in a race, and ferrari wins everything. its humorous.<

There are a few "true believers" but these are the lemming dignitary few, that are so far invested in the series, anything they do can be rationalized by "Evolution" and various other excuses like "too many entertainiment options", "its the economy", etc etc etc. I can't say there are mnore than a hundred of these people. IMS has screwed so many people in the industry, and Gasoline Alley - where are the shops are, etc, is a freaking Ghosdt Town these days. The early indy gomers, the original "all oval, all american" crowd is beyond pizzed, and when Tony left, most of them did too. So Josie had Tony fired, and now she and her sisters have the rodeo clown and that is all. They bet the farm on this move, and guess what? Survey sez they are about to loose it all. At some point, somebuddy is just going to yell "Uncle" and walk away. These "advisors" on the IMS/IRL board have got to be seeing red bleeding from the bottom line. As advisors they HAVE TO show them how fubar'd this thing is.

So when do we hit bottom? What is the move that finally stops this trainwreck and throw their hands up in the air, "We give up"!

When the idiots are broke and can't keep it going anymore.

[Lux Interior]

And it's all CART's fault

Damm right it is. CART failed twice:gomer:

[SteveH]

Whenever I "embrace" debate with these folks

I have a question for you...... Why?

Why even give them the time of day?

These people are operating on a completely different set of values and a totally mistaken view of reality. No different than arguing for civil rights with a Klan member. These lemmings are just as wrong and strident in their beliefs as any Klan member is in theirs. They have supported the destruction of the sport since Day 1. They know Marion County and that is all. Representing that isn't sufficient credentials to elevate them to a status worthy of debate. There are fewer and fewer each year that value their opinion.

They are good for a laugh, though.

[SurfaceUnits]

So when do we hit bottom? What is the move that finally stops this trainwreck and throw their hands up in the air, "We give up"!When Mari's well preserved dead corpse is laying in the vigoda

[Spicoli]

I have a question for you...... Why?

Why even give them the time of day?

These people are operating on a completely different set of values and a totally mistaken view of reality. No different than arguing for civil rights with a Klan member. These lemmings are just as wrong and strident in their beliefs as any Klan member is in theirs. They have supported the destruction of the sport since Day 1. They know Marion County and that is all. Representing that isn't sufficient credentials to elevate them to a status worthy of debate. There are fewer and fewer each year that value their opinion.

They are good for a laugh, though.

Fair question: I always just "end up" in this situation. somebody knows i like racing, somebody sees the racing art on the walls at my house, etc etc....doesn't really take much to stir up that conversation in indy. so people fall into several categories:

1. Place Fans...they know just enough to be dumber than **** in a converstion. They like it but don't know crap. 75%

2. Place Fan +....they THINK they know what they are talking about until about 2 minutes into a conversation, they usually just walk away after a few jabs. 10%

3. Lemming enablers...these are the worst of the lot. They actually follow what is going on, and are IRL apologists. They hate everything that ain't IRL (or Dale Jr.), and can't wait to debate you on the above entioned ignorant views of ALMS, CaRT history, IRL versions 1.0 thru 16.8:rolleyes: and will go to the mat swinging AJ Foyt style. these are the turds I will chase down the driveway with my extremely high level of US OW rhetoric. Sometimes I even make **** up just to make them look stupider than they are.

All in all, there aint much else ta talk aboot here in Hooterville. I like to hit them deep in their Hulmanista core beliefs. And its fun to watch the lemmings squeal. :D

[Spicoli]

When Mari's well preserved dead corpse is laying in the vigoda


what about josie?

[SurfaceUnits]

That's "starched earth" instead of burned bridges.

yep, TOoked TOney GOrge only one year to kill the Copper World classic

[NismoZ]

And sleeping with the fishes, or horse heads..or whoever.

[trauma1]

They have been altering the wheelbase as of the last test session

seems like most of the blame if going to the sub contractors, none of which are in Indiana (where the tax breaks for the Italian company so they could do business in the "new" Speedway town)

nothing to see here, just waiting for the sunshine and rainbow articles by Oreo and the ilk.

which is B.S. when they were given pecs by the moranic committe asnd Dullarra they were given max weights for thier parts, which you can be pretty sure they meet, and now Dullarra and the idiot league, are throwing crap out there and see if it sticks, question? are the owners bound to acceppt this piece of kaka, and 2 expect the courts to be involved in this cluster *****:rofl::rofl::rofl:

[trauma1]

safety fail?

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2011/writers/brant_james/12/08/new.indy.car.safety/index.html

notice there was zip nada, nothing from the leagUe and Dullara bout crash test results which means agian the even *****er crapwagon most like does not meet FIA crash testing and before any gomer even trys , YES the DP01 did meet FIA crash testing regs, the kaka it didn't was started by little d, Fred Nation and his band of brownshirts, and to completly bow off Trammel and Olvey's recommendations is criminal:yuck::flame::thumdown:

[trauma1]

Did I read the highlighted part correctly? :confused:

and he was a memember he was on the moronic committe:shakehead

[trauma1]

I have a question fer ya'll:

Perspective: So - the gomer pack racing, crashes are cool, indy-centric mentality has all but killed the sport. Whenever I "embrace" debate with these folks, i ask them how many IRL races they go to each year. the answer is usually - 1, Indy. It used to be maybe 2 others, KY or mebbe MI or ORD, but lately, its just been one. And even fewer of them even watch the other races. Their core crowd is dwindling rapidly.

>Funny, they still tell me shoemaker wins everything in f1, and there is no passing, and they are eurosnobs and they only have 6 cars in a race, and ferrari wins everything. its humorous.<

There are a few "true believers" but these are the lemming dignitary few, that are so far invested in the series, anything they do can be rationalized by "Evolution" and various other excuses like "too many entertainiment options", "its the economy", etc etc etc. I can't say there are mnore than a hundred of these people. IMS has screwed so many people in the industry, and Gasoline Alley - where are the shops are, etc, is a freaking Ghosdt Town these days. The early indy gomers, the original "all oval, all american" crowd is beyond pizzed, and when Tony left, most of them did too. So Josie had Tony fired, and now she and her sisters have the rodeo clown and that is all. They bet the farm on this move, and guess what? Survey sez they are about to loose it all. At some point, somebuddy is just going to yell "Uncle" and walk away. These "advisors" on the IMS/IRL board have got to be seeing red bleeding from the bottom line. As advisors they HAVE TO show them how fubar'd this thing is.

So when do we hit bottom? What is the move that finally stops this trainwreck and throw their hands up in the air, "We give up"!

And the way the screwed over Lola, Swift, Pnoz and most of the manufactures, any manufacure that was involved with CART and Champcar have been basically blackballed by ICS and IMS, how could champcar get the DP01 so right and the idiots get the super crapwagon so wrong, champcar went with Hewland for the gear box, ,they had one minor problem with the fuel cell that was fixxed in less than a month, the sat the driver more upright, they listened to Trammel and Olvey and now cotman creadiblity is zero because he choose to get involved with this morans:shakehead:shakehead

[Chief]

did C^RT race at Kentucky 5 or 6 times?:tony::gomer:

were you sober when you made that list? Texas
Yes, I wasn't sober... Texas ain't on the list this AM and Indy is the only remaining orginial IRL track. :) Also, inside sources report IRL is desperate to buyout the 2012 Texas race just liek the Las Vegass one. From Cavin's list 2012 EaRL sKed (http://www.indystar.com/article/20111210/SPORTS0107/112100338/Search-continues-fill-out-IndyCar-s-12-schedule): (NOTE China in mid-August is a death-knell)

Announced races

Three ovals

» Indianapolis Motor Speedway (May 27)
» Iowa Speedway (June 24)
» Auto Club Speedway, Fontana, Calif. (Sept. 16)

Three road courses

» Barber Motorsports Park, Birmingham, Ala. (April 1)
» Mid-Ohio Sports Car Course, Lexington (Aug. 5)
» Infineon Raceway, Sonoma, Calif. (Aug. 26)

Eight street circuits

» St. Petersburg, Fla. (March 25)
» Long Beach, Calif. (April 15)
» Sao Paulo, Brazil (April 29)
» Detroit (June 3)
» Toronto (July 8)
» Edmonton (July 22)
» Qingdao, China (Aug. 19)
» Baltimore (Sept. 2)

Texas is labeled "IndyCar has only 14 at the moment, with the June 9 event at Texas Motor Speedway in limbo amid financial discussions."

[cameraman]

how could champcar get the DP01 so right

The DP01 was hardly "so right" until you compare it to the DW12 and then it becomes Nobel Prize worthy:rolleyes:

[DagoFast]

EIGHT stret races for the ealr loosers. bIF would be proud. :tony:

[mapguy]

When Mari's well preserved dead corpse is laying in the vigoda

Would Abe approve?

http://blog.blockbuster.com/wp-content/uploads/2011/02/abe_vigoda.jpg

[emjaya]

» Qingdao, China (Aug. 19)


A street race in China? When did that happen?

[Methanolandbrats]

A street race in China? When did that happen?

Chinese Champ Car Fans rioted last year and demanded it.

[Duroc]

A street race in China? When did that happen?

It hasn't yet. Hapless IRL, grain of salt, etc.


The answer to Spicoli's question is a chapter 7 bankruptcy filing. Nobody is going to shove a pot of gold at this disaster.

[SurfaceUnits]

what about josie?

she's the one who got TOney fired because he was spending too much of her kids' money

[Rex Karz]

So when do we hit bottom? What is the move that finally stops this trainwreck and throw their hands up in the air, "We give up"!

When the Brickyard is silent for the month of May.

[Ripped]

how could champcar get the DP01 so right and the idiots get the super crapwagon so wrong,

Spec racing is crap and the DP01 was a spec car. Champcar didn't get anything right with that car. Just because it was a better car than the joke that the IRL is putting out there doesn't make it a good idea.

[SurfaceUnits]

Spec racing is crap and the DP01 was a spec car. Champcar didn't get anything right with that car. Just because it was a better car than the joke that the IRL is putting out there doesn't make it a good idea.

yeah it was horrible,,,,, I mean it only set a few track records with a detuned motor and rent a ride drivers.

[opinionated ow]

Spec racing is crap and the DP01 was a spec car. Champcar didn't get anything right with that car. Just because it was a better car than the joke that the IRL is putting out there doesn't make it a good idea.

And if my memory serves me correctly it was almost as ugly and had lots of issues in its early development too. And it failed on the one thing they sold it on the most-the onboard starter

[Spicoli]

DP01 > crapwagon or supercrapwagon, fo sho.

[RTKar]

Consider what was going on in CC when the DP01 was introduced. A new affordable spec was needed in a struggling series, to produce speeds and raceability on different types of courses and to portray the image of the series. It did reasonably well in the short time it was in use. It had a far better debut than the Death Wagon 12.

[SurfaceUnits]

And if my memory serves me correctly it was almost as ugly and had lots of issues in its early development too. And it failed on the one thing they sold it on the most-the onboard starter:rolleyes: too much woop woop

[Methanolandbrats]

http://paddocktalk.com/news/html/modules/ew_filemanager/06images/ptalk/06/ccws/road%20america/dp01-duquenne.jpg

or http://dlstatic.speedtv.com/imageserve/01AFalJ1SzdvJ/575x459.jpg?fit=scale&background=000000

[cameraman]

You are comparing a mediocre spec open wheel formula with what looks to be the worst spec open wheel formula in human history.

It doesn't make the DP01 any less mediocre, it was what it was and it provided some decent spec racing in its first year. Given another year or two they could have improved it to provide some extremely good spec racing, the top level spec racing on the globe perhaps. Still spec racing but there is such a thing as very good spec racing.

[SurfaceUnits]

spec open wheel formula



that is what cart left available,,,,starched earth

[cameraman]

We live in an age where it takes cubic dollars to gain a 1/10 of a second on a 3 mile lap. Just ask McLaren or Ferrari and that is with all manner of FIA restrictions on development & testing. No one on the planet can afford a truly open series anymore.

[Chief]

From a design and aestetics aspect, I liked the DP01, way better than any POS crapwagon. It also raced pretty good too. If you differentiate that from the spec car aspect which is not good, there are some positives to be gleened (especially when waving an appendage in the hopeful 2012 IRl faces).

http://spbcar.ru/news/en/i/2006-08-03/panoz4.jpg

http://spbcar.ru/news/en/i/2006-08-03/panoz5.jpg

http://images.ookaboo.com/photo/m/Team_Australia_CCWS_Panoz_DP01_2007_m.jpg


62WDi1q6b_w

[SteveH]

http://www.autoracing1.com/Images/2011/IndyCar/Misc/2012IndyCarIndyTest2.jpg

The Future of Racing :rofl:

[Ziggy]

I have actually read enough of the pinning for the DP01. My employed racing friends who actually took delievery on these cars when new were pretty, uh, pissed at the amount of modifications to make them servicable at the time. They were expensive and forced on the teams, something that Champcar racing should never embrace.

They got them racing on time however.............

Nice to see the Earl getting ripped in this months issue of Motorsport, but it appears quite a bit of hindsight journalism is at play. It really sucks that no one wrote these damning articles before the accident at LMS. It's also sad that from a local Indianapolis/Speedway standpoint not one writer or reporter went after the Re Develope Speedway committee and exposed all the skullduggery that has been going on for the past six years. It ALL ties in with this dopey "League" and this hideous car.

Face it, racing is dead. It's not worth arguing with some stupid gomer over a beer.

[Gnam]

EIGHT stret races for the ealr loosers. bIF would be proud. :tony:

I had no idea it was so many. What happened? :D

[SteveH]

Remember this? http://www.f1fanatic.co.uk/2010/05/26/hrt-split-from-dallara/

Deja vu, gomers

[Methanolandbrats]

You are comparing a mediocre spec open wheel formula with what looks to be the worst spec open wheel formula in human history.

It doesn't make the DP01 any less mediocre, it was what it was and it provided some decent spec racing in its first year. Given another year or two they could have improved it to provide some extremely good spec racing, the top level spec racing on the globe perhaps. Still spec racing but there is such a thing as very good spec racing.

The DP01 was a lot less mediocre. It was actually pretty quick and it looked good. OTOH, the new *****ox is dog slow coming off corners and is ugly beyond comprehension. You are correct they are both spec, but that is where the similarity ends.

[SteveH]

http://www.trackforum.com/forums/showthread.php?158494-Pageneaud-Sebring-DW12-scanner-quote.....


Pageneaud Sebring DW12 scanner quote.....



"It's like driving an F3 now. No power in slow/medium, oversteer at high speed"

[Trevor Longman]

http://www.trackforum.com/forums/showthread.php?158494-Pageneaud-Sebring-DW12-scanner-quote.....

Was just about to post this. :rofl: Nice to hear some uncensored driver comments! :laugh:

[SteveH]

Dallara commits to making changes

http://auto-racing.speedtv.com/article/indycar-dallara-commits-to-dw12-updates/

Longer wheelbase, different oval aero kit, blah, blah, blah

[Chief]

Sweet! They're delivering an untested car with new untested suspension to the teams over the next month.

Their wind tunnel testing hasn't proved reliable to this point....who would have confidence now? They have to be 2 months out from even getting this thing to actual performance testing...what a joke. :rofl:

[SteveH]

http://i524.photobucket.com/albums/cc326/chien-ko/trainwreck.gif

[Elmo T]

Sounds like a car designed by committee.

Wait....what? :rolleyes:





I checked to make sure my use of designed by committee was appropriate:

From our wiki friends:

Design by committee is a term referring to a style of design and its resultant output when a group of entities comes together to produce something (often the design of technological systems or standards), particularly in the presence of poor leadership. The defining characteristics of "design by committee" are needless complexity, internal inconsistency, logical flaws, banality, and the lack of a unifying vision.

Yup - that was it.

[SurfaceUnits]

My employed racing friends who actually took delievery on these cars when new were pretty, uh, pissed at the amount of modifications to make them servicable at the time. .

what did your damed cart strret race loosing refuges want,,,something to roll in that they could put some stickers on it and call it day? Sounds like it provided work and paychecks for some people. Sounds to me liek a good woman,,,just needs some finishing touches here and there

[SteveH]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/breaking/bs-md-grand-prix-loan-20111213,0,178217.story?page=1&track=rss&reader_38164=94318

:rofl:

[chop456]

Dear God. Is anyone involved with the leeg anything other than a complete moron? :laugh:

"Call Montel Williams! He always helps!" :gomer:

[Spicoli]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/breaking/bs-md-grand-prix-loan-20111213,0,178217.story?page=1&track=rss&reader_38164=94318

:rofl:

Wow. Ya think they stepped into it on this one? :saywhat:

Grand juries?

just wow.

[Methanolandbrats]

1.1 million loan for two months and 500, 000 interest? Isn't that kind of a high finance rate? :D

[Trevor Longman]

Christ they're live streaming the press conference to discuss the findings of the Wheldon crash investigation. I don't want to seem insensitive but get over yourselves. Yes it was tragic and unnecessary but theres no reason to bring this back into the media spotlight. :shakehead

http://www.indianapolismotorspeedway.com/indy500/multimedia/42440/?hide_sidebar=true

[datachicane]

http://www.baltimoresun.com/news/breaking/bs-md-grand-prix-loan-20111213,0,178217.story?page=1&track=rss&reader_38164=94318

:rofl:

500k interest on a two-month note for 1.1M?
Accourse that's better than your local car title loan outfit, but still worse than most loan sharks.

[Ankf00]

well, when your assets are worth zilch and your business model is worth less with a very strong chance for exponentially negative growth, it's kinda hard to obtain serious financing

[Ziggy]

A live press conference? Really?

Is TG running it?

Dan,,,,, Ummmmmmmm, Uhhhhhhhhhhhh, forgive me, uuuuuuuuuuuuh, I have forgotten my papers,,,,,,,, unnnnmmmmmmmmmmmmm, Dan, Ummmmmmmmmmmmmmmm, hit his head.

[extramundane]

500k interest on a two-month note for 1.1M?
Accourse that's better than your local car title loan outfit, but still worse than most loan sharks.

Sounds like they hit up that Western Sky Financial outfit. "Sure the money's expensive, but it's much cheaper then a payday loan" :rofl:

[Rex Karz]

500k interest on a two-month note for 1.1M?
Accourse that's better than your local car title loan outfit, but still worse than most loan sharks.

http://www.darkhorizons.com/assets/0012/5153/capone_article.jpg?1284477476
"Hey, where can I get in on some of that action?"

[SteveH]

There's a sucker born every minute.
\
http://www25.uua.org/uuhs/duub/images/ptbarnum1.jpg


BTW - this is interesting/ironic..... http://t-sciences.com/ethics/overview/

[Ripped]

Christ they're live streaming the press conference to discuss the findings of the Wheldon crash investigation. I don't want to seem insensitive but get over yourselves. Yes it was tragic and unnecessary but theres no reason to bring this back into the media spotlight. :shakehead

http://www.indianapolismotorspeedway.com/indy500/multimedia/42440/?hide_sidebar=true

You know, I won't watch that but the spin should be somewhat interesting. I'm willing to bet that there will be no blame aimed at IMS or IRL. :shakehead

[Trevor Longman]

You know, I won't watch that but the spin should be somewhat interesting. I'm willing to bet that there will be no blame aimed at IMS or IRL. :shakehead

...."and don't worry the new car will fix everything."

[Methanolandbrats]

You know, I won't watch that but the spin should be somewhat interesting. I'm willing to bet that there will be no blame aimed at IMS or IRL. :shakehead Read this and you won'thave to watch it:

Random, tragic event that has occured throughout the history of motor racing. IRL safety record is outstanding and included development of safer barrier. The IRL will strive for further improvements in driver safety. Not returning to Vegas is not a result of the accident, but an independant business decision by the track and the IRL. We look forward to renewing our partnership in the future. We look forward to an exciting 2012 season.

[datachicane]

Read this and you won'thave to watch it:

Random, tragic event that has occured throughout the history of motor racing. IRL safety record is outstanding and included development of safer barrier. The IRL will strive for further improvements in driver safety. Not returning to Vegas is not a result of the accident, but an independant business decision by the track and the IRL. We look forward to renewing our partnership in the future. We look forward to an exciting 2012 season.

That could've been written two weeks (or five years) ago.

[Chief]

Notes from conference:

125 feet Hildebrand flew....."crashes occurred that were common to the sport"....166mph was speed when Wheldon hit rear tire and got airborne....then traveled 325 feet in air/wall....fencepost caused blunt force trauma, fence worked as designed....each 1.5 oval will be considered separately as to whether it will be suitable in the future....Las Vegas track allowed too much movement due to track design (and apparently not discovered during track inspection or considered when track was added).....limitless lanes usable at Las Vegas....

"Perfect storm".....2011 crapwagon IR3 dallara "best safety record"....Indycar will evaluate if new car will be able race at Las Vegas.....car not responsible for crash.....fencing design at Las Vegas didn't make a difference, even though Indy car prefers fenceposts to be OUTSIDE the fencing (Las vegas' fenceposts are trackside of the fencing)..... las Vegas not safe for our racecars....


BLAMELESS ingnorant bulls****. :thumdown:

[Methanolandbrats]

Hey, I was pretty close, but I never figured it would be the tracks fault. Kinda odd considering that the IRL CHOSE to race there. Did the track change after they booked the date? :gomer:

[Andrew Longman]

Posts are trackside?

Wasn't that the case at Texas when Brack had his deal?

Didn't everyone decide THEN that was a bad idea?

[extramundane]

"I ran outta gas. I had a flat tire. I didn't have enough money for cab fare. My tux didn't come back from the cleaners. An old friend came in from outta town. Someone stole my car. There was an earthquake, a terrible flood, locusts. It wasn't my fault!! I swear to God!!"

-Brian Barnhart

[SurfaceUnits]

just another case of getting exactly what you expected

if smack comes back, y'all can launch your own independent investigation

[patski]

White Wash!

[SteveH]

entire report is herehttp://www.16thandgeorgetown.com/2011/12/wheldon-incident-investigation-results.html

[High Sided]

video...

X2r3ZsJrh50

[Ed_Severson]

Reading through the report I don't find too many bones to pick. Other than screwing up the citation of the length of their own cars :rolleyes: and the claim that "the race car being driven at the Las Vegas Motor Speedway has evolved into a race vehicle with an unmatched safety record in open wheel racing" I think the analysis was reasonable and accurate. I'd like to see a transcript of the press conference, though I suspect it'll be a few hours before that's findable.

[Chief]

Reading through the report I don't find too many bones to pick. Other than screwing up the citation of the length of their own cars :rolleyes: and the claim that "the race car being driven at the Las Vegas Motor Speedway has evolved into a race vehicle with an unmatched safety record in open wheel racing" I think the analysis was reasonable and accurate. I'd like to see a transcript of the press conference, though I suspect it'll be a few hours before that's findable.
I'm offended by the ignorance of this sanctioning body to utilize the cumulative data collected over the past 15 years (and the last 8 years specifically) of the chassis' tendency to become airborne, a HUGE factor in the killing of Dan Wheldon. The fact the ignorant morAns that run this series refuse to accept culpability in any of it turns my stomach as anyone ever who has been killed in an IRL race just had their graves pist on at this press conference. Idiots.:flame:

[Ziggy]

Ed does not have a bone to pick. Wow, never saw that one coming either:tony:

Johnny Byrds welcomes you with open arms

Crapwagons been flying since the get go

[Gnam]

footnote 30 from Accident Report:

Pack racing is a phenomenon seen in all forms of auto racing in which cars cannot achieve significant separation from each other on the race track. The result of the lack of separation is that the cars move around the race track in a "pack" during portions of a race, most typically at the beginning of a race and after re-starts.

Everything's normal. :gomer::thumbup:
That grater just lept out in front of Dan Wheldon's car. Just a freak accident. No way to see it coming. Who knew? We'll do better next time.

:yuck: