View Full Version : Andretti/Cadillac F1 team
Christian Horner 'surprised' Andretti consulted Congress over F1 bid
https://www.espn.co.uk/f1/story/_/id/40210188/christian-horner-surprised-andretti-gone-congress
F1 News: Andretti Delivered Another Blow To Formula One Hopes
https://www.si.com/fannation/racing/f1briefings/news/f1-news-andretti-delivered-another-blow-to-formula-one-hopes-01hyr7ss3dbb-lm22#:~:text=The%20heightened%20entry%20fees%20and ,for%20Andretti%20Global's%20F1%20ambitions.
At present, the F1 Concorde Agreement — the contract that outlines the commercial terms of engagement for teams and organizers — is preparing for a major revision that will commence in 2026. This pending transformation brings with it the contemplation of increasing entry fees for new teams. The current one-time fee stands at $200 million, aimed at compensating the existing teams for potential revenue loss due to increased competition. However, a staggering proposal suggests raising this fee to $600 million by 2026 and further to $700 million by 2028, distributed over five years, according to Autosport. This financial leap could significantly strain the ambitions of entrants like Andretti Global, who are fighting for a potential 2026 grid entry and if not, an entry in 2028.
Not really a surprise, been discussed for some time now.
Why F1 and teams are still not impressed by Andretti’s entry plans (https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/why-f1-and-teams-are-still-not-impressed-by-andrettis-new-team-plans/10418569/)
I wonder how much of Andretti’s difficulties of getting admitted to the club trace back to his approach? I recall he got a cold shoulder when asking team owners to sign a letter of support at a race, maybe the initial Miami GP.
Wouldn’t surprise me at all if this was the initial cause. Add to that the significant increase in value of each team since then. Buying a team maybe his only way in, but that won’t be cheap now.
TravelGal
05-28-24, 12:15 PM
I wonder how much of Andretti’s difficulties of getting admitted to the club trace back to his approach? I recall he got a cold shoulder when asking team owners to sign a letter of support at a race, maybe the initial Miami GP.
Wouldn’t surprise me at all if this was the initial cause. Add to that the significant increase in value of each team since then. Buying a team maybe his only way in, but that won’t be cheap now.
I agree but they also surely don't want to allow ANYONE in until they can triple the entry price. :rolleyes:
https://x.com/A_S12/status/1795509763553300773
devilmaster
05-28-24, 08:21 PM
Stewart/Haas Nascar is shutting down and selling their spots on the tintop grid.
Ben sulemayan says 'go buy one of the existing teams'...
So some things you can infer from all this:
- Ben has really no power or authority anymore.... He played his cards earlier in this situation arguing that we support an 11th team, and acted shocked when the teams said no, and now he is admitting he can't make it happen. I can see him being replaced soon.
- I suspect Gene Haas is done, and I suspect if he does it will happen before the end of the season.
- Even if Andretti tries to buy an existing team, I suspect there will still be some pushback and maybe talk that someone who missed out on the Audi purchase (like F2 team Carlin) will get preferential treatment on a f1 team purchase.. simply because they don't want Andretti now.
- I think F1 is protected from any true congressional questions simply because Haas is around. 'We have an American team owner!'
stroker
05-30-24, 07:19 AM
Stewart/Haas Nascar is shutting down and selling their spots on the tintop grid.
Ben sulemayan says 'go buy one of the existing teams'...
So some things you can infer from all this:
- Ben has really no power or authority anymore.... He played his cards earlier in this situation arguing that we support an 11th team, and acted shocked when the teams said no, and now he is admitting he can't make it happen. I can see him being replaced soon.
- I suspect Gene Haas is done, and I suspect if he does it will happen before the end of the season.
- Even if Andretti tries to buy an existing team, I suspect there will still be some pushback and maybe talk that someone who missed out on the Audi purchase (like F2 team Carlin) will get preferential treatment on a f1 team purchase.. simply because they don't want Andretti now.
- I think F1 is protected from any true congressional questions simply because Haas is around. 'We have an American team owner!'
Could the Andretti coalition be paying Haas to quit?
The problem with the F1 anti-dilution fee (https://speedcafe.com/the-problem-with-the-f1-anti-dilution-fee/)
a good explainer and analysis
Auto giant Hyundai reported to be keen on F1 entry
https://www.motorsportweek.com/2024/06/04/auto-giant-hyundai-reported-to-be-keen-on-f1-entry/
Unfortunately for Hyundai, no F1 teams are up for sale currently, at least publicly, so entering the sport in the near future could prove tricky.
However, signalling intent to join F1 by buying its way will endear Hyundai to the likes of Formula One Management (FOM), with plans from Andretti to start a team from the ground up not playing well thus far.
Cadillac better have deep pockets.
Cadillac is rumored to drop F1 unless Andretti is approved.
Cadillac is rumored to drop F1 unless Andretti is approved.
:thumbup:
F1 Rumor: Andretti's Formula One Hopes Improve As General Motors Set To Strike Deal With Existing Team
https://www.newsweek.com/sports/formula1/f1-rumor-andrettis-formula-one-hopes-improve-general-motors-set-strike-deal-existing-team-1930903
Newsweek, the first choice for F1 news
FORMER ALPINE BOSS SZAFNAUER INVOLVED IN NEW US F1 PROJECT
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/former-alpine-boss-szafnauer-involved-in-new-us-f1-project/10640483/
"I've been working with some organisations in North America that have the funding to start an 11th team.
"It's not Andretti. Now we're just putting some of those building blocks in place to make sure that we have everything that's required in order to be successful to both start a team, but also get an entry. So, you know, that's interesting too."
nissan gtp
08-04-24, 09:55 AM
FORMER ALPINE BOSS SZAFNAUER INVOLVED IN NEW US F1 PROJECT
https://www.motorsport.com/f1/news/former-alpine-boss-szafnauer-involved-in-new-us-f1-project/10640483/
Needs more toasters
Al Czervik
08-05-24, 10:34 AM
Needs more toasters
Good Times
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMh3qu5GtZA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMh3qu5GtZA
nissan gtp
08-07-24, 08:39 AM
Good Times
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMh3qu5GtZA
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nMh3qu5GtZA
I'd forgotten those. Good time indeed. :rofl:
F1 face major investigation into Andretti rejection (https://racingnews365.com/f1-face-major-investigation-into-andretti-rejection)
F1 owners Liberty Media is to be investigated by the United States Department of Justice following its handling of Andretti's now-rejected application to join the F1 grid.
Mikey has a new SPAC, his second
https://www.renaissancecapital.com/Profile/POLEU/Andretti-Acquisition-II/IPO
https://x.com/Sportico/status/1839678419207872844
:eek:
MICHAEL ANDRETTI TO EXIT OWNERSHIP OF ANDRETTI GLOBAL (https://www.sportico.com/leagues/motorsports/2024/michael-andretti-exit-ownership-andretti-global-1234798932/)
Michael Andretti is relinquishing his ownership stake in Andretti Global, the motorsports company he has helmed since 2002, according to three people with knowledge of the move.
relinquishing is not selling
Michael Andretti hands over control of race team to business partner. Formula 1 plans in limbo
https://www.wtnh.com/sports/ap-michael-andretti-hands-over-control-of-race-team-to-business-partner-formula-1-plans-in-limbo/
The transition was first reported by Sportico, a publication owned by Roger Penske’s son. Andretti and Penske have been at odds the entire season with Andretti complaining at the March season-opening race that Penske was not spending enough to properly market the series and if he wasn’t willing to pump in the needed cash, he said Penske should sell IndyCar and Indianapolis Motor Speedway.
The comments infuriated Penske, and his leadership group slowly began dealing more directly with Towriss instead of Andretti. The amplification of the resentment between Andretti and Penske grew as the season went on and in late August, Andretti leadership noted there was a clear conflict of interest when Penske driver Josef Newgarden was not penalized for various maneuvers while winning at Gateway outside St. Louis.
E tu Roger?
Let’s not forget this
“I was asked to go there. And just as I was trying to explain that to Stefano, Greg Maffei, Mr. Maffei, broke in the conversation and he said: 'Mario, I want to tell you that I will do everything in my power to see that Michael never enters Formula 1,'” Andretti said.
https://www.nbcnews.com/news/sports/mario-andretti-formula-1-owner-personally-threatened-shut-team-andrett-rcna153601
Not that I believe Maffei had anything to do about this. At least that is apparent.
Michael Andretti tells AP ‘timing was right’ for a restructuring of Andretti Global
https://apnews.com/article/indycar-andretti-towriss-ownership-0675f357777558dc36050a42b53de451
Makes it sound like he wanted this but then there is this…
Andretti said he’ll for sure be at the Indianapolis 500 this year, where son Marco has a contract to run for the team. Beyond that? He doesn’t know.
Been aggressively investing in the future with the new HQ and the facility in England and starting in F1. Then to decide he’s done? I’m not buying that.
https://x.com/jennafryer/status/1841288632428023820?s=61&t=oFXcsN2wTfApq6UdUB40Qg
Hmmmm….l
The RACER Mailbag, October 2 (https://racer.com/2024/10/02/the-racer-mailbag-october-2/)
Lots of Q&A on what's going on, but no definitive answers.
Being rumored that Cadillac is moving ahead into F1 without Andretti. There is a suggestion that Cadillac and Towriss asked Andretti to step aside. Cadillac may buy his shares at Andretti Global. If so, washing out of F1 in 1983 pales compared to this.
Being rumored that Cadillac is moving ahead into F1 without Andretti. There is a suggestion that Cadillac and Towriss asked Andretti to step aside. Cadillac may buy his shares at Andretti Global. If so, washing out of F1 in 1983 pales compared to this.
1993
letter from Michael (https://andrettiglobal.com/news/2024/10/an-open-letter-from-michael-andretti/)
I wonder if he would have written this had F1 accepted him.....
General Motors has not abandoned the idea of reaching F1 and now they are in charge of the negotiations (https://soymotor-com.translate.goog/f1/noticias/general-motors-no-ha-abandonado-la-idea-de-llegar-la-f1-y-ahora-llevan-las-riendas?_x_tr_sl=auto&_x_tr_tl=en&_x_tr_hl=en&_x_tr_pto=wapp)
not sure the translation will work through the link.
original site https://soymotor.com/f1/noticias/general-motors-no-ha-abandonado-la-idea-de-llegar-la-f1-y-ahora-llevan-las-riendas
"On the F1 side, we've been working on it for two years. It's a process. We're intensively developing a power unit. We're intensively developing the car. We'll continue with the process. We had some positive meetings last week. We're not giving up. We've committed to being involved. One way or another, we'll be there," Warren said.
Zapata Computing, Early Quantum-AI Software Specialist, Ceases Operations
https://www.hpcwire.com/2024/10/14/zapata-computing-early-quantum-ai-software-specialist-ceases-operations/
Andretti’s first SPAC invested heavily in this.
Things are coming into focus now….
ZAPATA COMPUTING HOLDINGS INC. 10-K filing (https://ir.zapata.ai/node/7701/html)
GREEN NOTEBOOK FROM THE BRASSERIE WEPLER (https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2024/10/15/green-notebook-from-the-brasserie-wepler/#comments)
Selling off IP is an interesting way to make money and one quiet whisper I have heard in recent days, for a very good source, is that Cadillac has recently acquired the IP of Renault’s 2026 engine. This is entirely logical, although no-one is ever going to admit such a thing. I remember a similar deal years ago when Honda quit F1 and Ferrari is supposed to have bought its V12 technology. These days people seem a little less uptight about saying they are buying technology from others, but I guess that GM is probably very old school in this respect. Still, there is nothing new under the sun. Engine technology has flowed between manufacturers since the dawn of motorsport…
Obviously Cadillac moving forward with F1, at least as an engine supplier. Cadillac probably would have done this with or without Andretti.
The ‘eye-watering’ amount of money Andretti are spending on F1 compared to the current teams (https://www.f1oversteer.com/news/the-eye-watering-amount-of-money-andretti-are-spending-on-f1-compared-to-the-current-teams/?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter)
The F1 contract clause that could cost Liberty billions (https://speedcafe.com/the-f1-contract-clause-that-could-cost-liberty-billions/)
a very deep dive...
It’s unclear where the Department of Justice investigation into Formula 1 and the Andretti denial stands and what conclusion it might reach.
What is clear is that Formula 1 Management’s ability to reject Andretti’s entry demonstrates it wields a regulatory power, something which was ruled against more than 20 years ago by the EU Commission.
In the intervening years something has changed, though exactly when, where, and how remain shrouded in secrecy.
As for its legality, that is for the Department of Justice or other such bodies to determine.
There remains mystery about what is happening with Andretti Global, which is now wholly-owned by entities belonging to Guggenheim Partners, with the Andretti family no longer involved in anything other than name. The team does not have an F1 entry but is still recruiting staff. It is obviously not restrained by any cost cap and so can offer engineers more money than the existing teams. Quite what they are hoping to achieve remains unclear but I suppose that the logic is to have a team ready for 2026, just in case an entry pops up. Perhaps there is hope that General Motors will decide to take the team on and so the current investor can get some money back, but it is not entirely clear whether GM is willing to invest the sort of money required to buy a team without an entry. Being owned by GM would make a big difference if the FIA decides to reopen entries, but the federation may not be very keen on that idea, as the last entry process resulted in all kind of trouble, not least an arbitration case, launched by Hitech, which seems to be favouring the team. There has been a judgement but because it is all confidential I have not seen a copy. If anyone out there has a copy I’d be happy to see it… As I understand it, the two parties involved are waiting to hear what it is all going to cost. No-one is going to talk about that, least of all the FIA President as he wants to keep the member clubs happy as he is facing an election a year from now. Someone somewhere is going to find out the numbers one day and that could have an impact on voting behaviour if the number is big enough.
https://joesaward.wordpress.com/2024/10/30/green-notebook-from-the-viaducto-presidente-miguel-aleman-valdes/
General Motors closing on F1 entry from 2026
https://www.bbc.com/sport/formula1/articles/c3vly6rlxe9o
Andretti owner Dan Towriss is at the Las Vegas Grand Prix this weekend working on the entry. It will be purely GM, and Andretti will not be involved once it is up and running, sources say.
https://x.com/a_s12/status/1860447973639143577?s=57
https://x.com/a_s12/status/1860004352913735764?s=57
https://x.com/fastestpitstop/status/1860422644782268838?s=57
Mario Andretti reveals his plans for America's new Formula 1 team
https://www.nbcnews.com/sports/motorsports/mario-andretti-reveals-plans-americas-new-formula-1-team-rcna181722
I think they must have Michael tied up in a closet somewhere.
nissan gtp
11-27-24, 11:26 AM
Mario Andretti reveals his plans for America's new Formula 1 team
https://www.nbcnews.com/sports/motorsports/mario-andretti-reveals-plans-americas-new-formula-1-team-rcna181722
I think they must have Michael tied up in a closet somewhere.
"No questions about Michael"
An excerpt from pitpass.com newsletter
For as long as he can remember, yours truly has had the ability to name the perpetrator in movies and TV dramas.
Not the easy ones mind, but those that demand the use of logic, attention to detail, analytical skill, patience and all the rest required by your above average Columbo.
However, despite this talent, for the life of him, yours truly cannot work out what went wrong with Michael Andretti's F1 bid.
For the last couple of years the American has fought tooth and nail to enter the club and faced rejection at every level.
He steps down, and a few weeks later his 'engine partner' is given the green light, while dad - the legendary Mario - is on board as a director, and a vocal one at that.
Make no mistake this was more than a personal issue between Michael and Greg Maffei, after all the Liberty CEO is also heading out the door.
We have heard talk, indeed we have been passed numerous documents relating to an intellectual property case, and, trust us, it is very, very complicated, but we are still at a loss to understand exactly why Michael was clearly the issue.
I’ll take a shot at this, a variety of reasons why:
F1 would prefer manufacturers to be team owners rather than engine suppliers. Huge benefit to F1.
Michael has no gravitas in F1, or very little. Certainly much less than Mario has, however I don’t think he has all that much anymore. He was entitled to nothing.
Mikey has proven to be a poor businessman. He has lost millions of other people’s money with the Zapata AI debacle. The last thing F1 wants is a team to enter and then fail. Avoiding recent history of that occurring.
Micheal was too much in their face. Promoting his entry openly outside of normal channels. Whining to the press.
Mikey is a jerk. Never one to be endearing. The ugly American personified.
The RACER Mailbag, November 27
https://racer.com/2024/11/27/the-racer-mailbag-november-27/
Liberty Media had major issues with Andretti. And General Motors, as I was told, also took issue — far too much drama and public-facing instability for its liking — and an initiative to move forward without the Michael Andretti distractions was hatched to get Cadillac into that 11th F1 entry slot.
Everything we’ve seen since then has fallen in line with what those sources spelled out in September because that’s precisely what’s been unveiled. We also noted how, in everything prior to Michael’s exit, the F1 team was presented as Andretti+Cadillac, and how in a post-Michael world, the new positioning was of Cadillac as the entrant, minus the Andretti name. But that never meant the Andretti team went away.
Pruitt also suspects no Andretti involvement in IndyCar next year
pfc_m_drake
11-30-24, 09:59 AM
Sounds like the bottom line is that Michael Andretti is just too unlikeable to be involved with anything. I never was a fan either, to be honest.
nissan gtp
12-04-24, 09:26 AM
Sounds like the bottom line is that Michael Andretti is just too unlikeable to be involved with anything. I never was a fan either, to be honest.
yeah, that seemed to be the issue
New motorsports leadership executives introduced as Andretti Global moves on without Andretti
https://apnews.com/article/andretti-leadership-f1-indycar-duchardt-gregory-16eac4951b924f411fab18dece29f50e
Sounds like the bottom line is that Michael Andretti is just too unlikeable to be involved with anything. I never was a fan either, to be honest.
Are the other team principals all "warm and fuzzy"?
Daniel Ricciardo named top candidate for Cadillac F1 venture – report (https://www.motorsportweek.com/2024/12/12/daniel-ricciardo-named-top-candidate-for-cadillac-f1-venture-report/)
Pilgrims Drop
12-14-24, 05:10 AM
Danny Ric was fast a while ago... but come on...
nissan gtp
12-15-24, 09:15 AM
Danny Ric was fast a while ago... but come on...
Bottas would be a much better choice
https://www.autoracing1.com/wp-content/uploads/2024/f1/misc/andretti-team-name-changed.jpg
Mario starts at 15 minutes
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