Wagons vs. SUVs

[RacinM3]

We just dumped our 2000 Dodge Durango for a 2000 BMW 528i wagon. This thing has the room of the Durango, isn't a minivan, gets 28 highway MPG vs. about 14 for the Durango, and handles like, well, a BMW 528i.

Anybody else out there considering dumping their SUVs? If so, are you considering a wagon? BMW, Audi, etc. etc. are making some pretty sweet ones now!

[JoeBob]

This is just begging for me to repost my rant in the Honda Element thread, since it is pretty much as I described. :D

Here's the Soccer mom/SUV thing. It is a rather vicious cycle, based mostly on feeling young. Most "new mothers" are between 20 and 30. They don't want to be driving what the 31-40 year old women are driving.

In the mid 1970s, the new mothers all drove station wagons.
When the mid 1980s rolled around, the 31-40 year old mothers kept buying station wagons, but the "new moms" didn't want to be seen in one. Thus, the minivan came to be popular among the women who first had kids from the mid-80s until the mid-90s.

Of course, the next batch of new mothers, didn't want to be seen in the minivans that those they viewed as "old mothers" drove, so they all flocked to SUVs. (And, in the mean time, station wagons faded into oblivion.)

These days, the SUV is falling out of grace with the new mother set, and the station wagon is coming back. 5 years ago, hardly anybody made station wagons anymore. (Even Honda, Toyota and Ford dropped the Accord, Camry and Taurus wagons.) There's the influx of Subarus, the Toyota Matrix, that new Mazda wagon. Everyone seems to be coming up with a "sport wagon" and the new mom's are starting to switch over from SUVs to wagons. (And, just like happened to the station wagon 10 years ago, sales of mini-vans are plummeting.)

Unless somehow the shoeboxes like the passports become all the rage with the new mom set, I'd look to see a lot more station wagons over the next decade, while the minivan becomes almost invisible. At least we can look forward to 10 years from now, when the minivan makes a comeback, and it is the SUV's turn to take a 10 year hiatus.

[RacinM3]

Our situation couldn't be farther from your scenario, though. We bought the Durango because of it's ability to tow 8,000 lbs., and while we could have gotten a pickup for that, this was a car my wife drives daily, so it had to have some comfort and the ability to carry more than two (we have no kids). My trailering issues have gone away, and it no longer made sense to have this gas-hogging truck, yet we still have a 110 lb. labrador, and he needs to go somewhere. This car is the perfect blend of agility and carrying capability. If I never had the need to tow, we never would have gotten such a big SUV.

[rabbit]

http://www.carsonline.net/images/95volvo918-A.jpg
:thumbup:

[Sean O'Gorman]

Originally posted by JoeBob
This is just begging for me to repost my rant in the Honda Element thread, since it is pretty much as I described. :D

Here's the Soccer mom/SUV thing. It is a rather vicious cycle, based mostly on feeling young. Most "new mothers" are between 20 and 30. They don't want to be driving what the 31-40 year old women are driving.

In the mid 1970s, the new mothers all drove station wagons.
When the mid 1980s rolled around, the 31-40 year old mothers kept buying station wagons, but the "new moms" didn't want to be seen in one. Thus, the minivan came to be popular among the women who first had kids from the mid-80s until the mid-90s.

Of course, the next batch of new mothers, didn't want to be seen in the minivans that those they viewed as "old mothers" drove, so they all flocked to SUVs. (And, in the mean time, station wagons faded into oblivion.)

These days, the SUV is falling out of grace with the new mother set, and the station wagon is coming back. 5 years ago, hardly anybody made station wagons anymore. (Even Honda, Toyota and Ford dropped the Accord, Camry and Taurus wagons.) There's the influx of Subarus, the Toyota Matrix, that new Mazda wagon. Everyone seems to be coming up with a "sport wagon" and the new mom's are starting to switch over from SUVs to wagons. (And, just like happened to the station wagon 10 years ago, sales of mini-vans are plummeting.)

Unless somehow the shoeboxes like the passports become all the rage with the new mom set, I'd look to see a lot more station wagons over the next decade, while the minivan becomes almost invisible. At least we can look forward to 10 years from now, when the minivan makes a comeback, and it is the SUV's turn to take a 10 year hiatus.

SUVs going out of fashion? Not where I'm from. Everyone has "dubs" on their Blazers and Explorers around here now. They go 20 mph under the speed limit because they are too afraid of damaging the $3000 wheels!

[anait]

JoeBob's observations are very interesting. :D Although we fought tooth and nail against buying a minivan...didn't matter that we were 'of age' to be wanting one!! :laugh: But we had 2 kids to tote around, and hubby is a big 'n tall guy.

We're slowly growing out of the Odyssey, though. Three of the four kids are still small, but our nearly-11 yr old is very uncomfortable in the middle or back bench seats...she's as tall as me, and getting taller every other day, it seems. She has to stick her legs over the seat in front for comfort, which is a pain for the other members of the family. :D

So what do we do? Get a honkin' big SUV, looking ahead to fit 4 giant teenagers in the back? Or get two new Civics or Insights, and take two vehicles everywhere? We also need a truck to work on our new country lot... Hm. Wonder if the gas costs on two compacts would be close to those on one big SUV... ;)

[JT265]

"Hm. Wonder if the gas costs on two compacts would be close to those on one big SUV... "

pssst! anait!

Head for Canadian Tire and get yourself a "Cape Breton Credit Card".
These can usually be found in the garden section, under the heading "hoses", and generally in 50' lengths.

Makes the ownership of a big honkin' SUV much more palatable. :D

[anait]

Originally posted by JT265

pssst! anait!

Head for Canadian Tire and get yourself a "Cape Breton Credit Card".
These can usually be found in the garden section, under the heading "hoses", and generally in 50' lengths.

Makes the ownership of a big honkin' SUV much more palatable. :D

:rofl: :thumbup:

[Dirty Sanchez]

I have a 2004 Audi S4 Avant on order... fast little grocery getter. Not that efficient but not as bad as your typical SUV. Its going to be be one hell of a sleeper car.

Wife and I don't have kids... that's why we can afford it :D

http://www.solace.mh.se/~asyvan/Bil/AudiS4/s4_avant1.jpg

[Sean O'Gorman]

Crapus-

Excellent choice! I've driven the previous gen S4, and I hear the new one has 90 extra hp w/o any extra weight added on. Possibly the most fun car you can buy without giving up the convenience of a sedan or wagon.

[oddlycalm]

We got an Audi A6 wagon in '99 to replace our Cherokee Ltd. No contest for anything except actual offroad excusions, which were rare in our case. Better mileage, better ride, quieter, more fun to drive, more room, and it actually hauls more. Simply no comparison on long high speed drives, as the Audi will float along in comfort at 80-90mph all day long.

The A6 will swallow everything from a 9ftx12ft oriental rug (rolled) to a bunch of 2x4 studs as long as you protect the console armrest. The backseat has so much legroom that even large men can be comfortable on an all day ride. The all wheel drive performance is better than the both the Jeep and our previous Chrysler AWD minivan.

While the retail price was substantially higher at $42,300, I was able to find it in another city with a factory model-year-end spiff at $33,800, which was less than either the Cherokee Ltd. or Chrysler AWD minivan when I bought it in September of 1999. Resale in this area has stayed strong.

The Audi is as solid a car as our BMW's have been, doesn't handle as well, nor has it been quite as reliable. However the dealer has fixed whatever was wrong quickly, without question, and at no charge. It didn't cost anywhere near what a BMW does either. The interior is nicer than the BMW's (by quite a lot), and the seats are the best I've ever encountered in any car. If VW/Audi are ever able to get their house in order regarding mfg. quality, they will be formidable.

oc

Edit: The A4 is a [i]lot more fun if you don't need the room of the A6. Just looking at the dimesions doesn't convey the difference. The feel of the steering geometry on A4 is a lot more sporting, and the A6 is much more sedate feeling. We needed the rear seat legroom for when business visitors are in town, so we had to go A6.

[RaceGrrl]

So Crapus will actually own a "CrapWagon" :laugh:

I think I'd choose the Audi over the Volvo. Great looking car for a wagon and much nicer than an SUV if you don't need to tow or go off-roading. :thumbup:

[Dirty Sanchez]

:laugh: :thumbup:

If I see any cw stickers on it I'm whooping ass though!

[nissan gtp]

Originally posted by RaceGrrl
So Crapus will actually own a "CrapWagon" :laugh:

I think I'd choose the Audi over the Volvo. Great looking car for a wagon and much nicer than an SUV if you don't need to tow or go off-roading. :thumbup:

LOL, a CrapusWagon that is...

too bad he couldn't get a Maxima Wagon, 'cause then he'd have a ....

[RaceGrrl]

Originally posted by nissan gtp
LOL, a CrapusWagon that is...

too bad he couldn't get a Maxima Wagon, 'cause then he'd have a ....

The Crapus Maxima Wagon!!! Excellent! :D :laugh:

What, Crapus... you wouldn't want us to vandalize your CrapWagon? Nothing wrong with that- the stickers peel right off.

[chop456]

We sold our Montero and bought a [gulp] Taurus wagon. Not because I wanted to, but because it was dirt cheap. A comparably priced Volvo was 6 years older with more than twice the miles. Hard to justify that.

Anyway, the Taurus will be traded in on a used A6 Wagon just as soon as my Golf is paid off. I promised Wifey she'd get the next "new" car, and I'm regretting it now that I've seen pics of the new Golf. Even better would be a Golf wagon like they get in Europe w/ a 150HP TDI-PD and a 6-speed, but such is life.

That said, i'd sure rather have an S4 Avant or an RS6. No doubt Crapus will be happy to let me borrow it whenever I want. ;) :D

Man, that's a nice car.

[IlliniRacer]

I'm currently in the market for a new car. I have a friend who is a VW dealer and is pushing the Passat Wagon. Anyone have any thoughts?

[chop456]

Originally posted by IlliniRacer
I'm currently in the market for a new car. I have a friend who is a VW dealer and is pushing the Passat Wagon. Anyone have any thoughts?

Here's my thought.

VW service is an oxymoron. Great car, but hope to god that it never breaks. And it WILL break, most likely. You're trading the Japanese appliance-like reliability and ho-hum driving experience for German soul.

The car will last forever until you're left with a crumbling shell holding an engine and transmission that still run fine. Mine has had only small problems, but they're nearly impossible to get fixed properly by the dealer. I have yet to deal with a VW service department that isn't run by nitwits, and corporate isn't any better.

Cars - great.
Dealers - idiots.

[mapguy]

I think you all know what mrs mapguy and I will be looking for if the time comes to get a shaggin' waggin.

http://ebay1.ipixmedia.com/abc/M28/_EBAY_32a7a66aa0a1e3acb4a384b126100bb1/i-1.JPG

:thumbup: Gotta get the big-block 2.0l option. Put some bling-blings and slam that puppy to the ground!

[RaceGrrl]

I spit my coffee out on that one, Mapguy. :D

[oddlycalm]

Originally posted by chop456
Anyway, the Taurus will be traded in on a used A6 Wagon just as soon as my Golf is paid off.

Depending on how you drive the car, I'm not sure the trade would be worth it. The Taurus is a good solid car and has a reasonable cost of operation. I like our A6 fine, but the Taurus is a good car (always my choice in rentals). Aside from interior trim and a bit more room, I'm not sure what if the A6 buys you anything extra if you don't need AWD. If I hadn't found an A6 that was discounted $8500, I'd be driving something else.

If you do buy a used A6, be sure that all the recalls have been performed, especially the bumper reinforcememt mod. Replacing the bumper cover is an $1800 drill, and you don't want to be left holding that bag. Audi is reimbursed me for having to replace mine twice, but the out of court settlement of the class action only covers original owners I believe. The other recall to look out for are the gas gauge sender unit. Check the window guides as well, and if they are original, I'd knock of the price of replacement from any offer. If you already have a VW, you're probably used to this kind of thing.

oc

[jons]

Iliniracer, We bought a '99 Passat wagon with 42,000 miles and its wonderful! It as the 1.8 turbo, which can be chipped safely to 200 hp.We've had the car for about 6 and mos. and have had no problems,just like the original owner. We have the complete history. AS stated above, dealers are the weak link. There are good ones, just do your research for the right one. Checkout http://www.vwvortex.com forum to find all the answers.

[Treeface]

Wife ditched the mini-van for a wagon. She got tired of pouring gas into it and having the lunatics unbelt themselves and taking over the asylum.

[anait]

Originally posted by Treeface
Wife ditched the mini-van for a wagon. She got tired of pouring gas into it and having the lunatics unbelt themselves and taking over the asylum.

:rofl: Oh, that's just the image I want, as we prepare to leave on a two week road trip with four kids!! Although fear of 'the wrath of mom' has been well-programmed into them... :eek: :p :D

[Sean O'Gorman]

Originally posted by Treeface
Wife ditched the mini-van for a wagon. She got tired of pouring gas into it and having the lunatics unbelt themselves and taking over the asylum.

Ah, the joys of having no obligation to transport people around. My car has only 2 seats, and the only time the passenger seat ever gets used is to carry my race tires to the autocross. :D

[Ankf00]

Originally posted by SOG35
Ah, the joys of having no obligation to transport people around. My car has only 2 seats, and the only time the passenger seat ever gets used is to carry my race tires to the autocross. :D

The women already know they're not welcome, you don't have to spell it out ;)

[RacinM3]

Your time's coming Sean, just you wait.:laugh: