View Full Version : Need info on Split for Business Class.
Hi all,
I've decided to write a paper on Open Wheel racing's recent history (from say 1993 on), so I'd like to gather as much material from this era as possible.
If people have things like newspaper links, television ratings (with sources), and other relevant articles, I'd appreciate if you can pass them along.
Many thanx
You need to go back further, at least until elmer getting shot. Probably until the end of WW2. The crap in 93 had been brewing for a long time.
fair enough, but it really brewed over then. I was thinking of moving my focus further back, but i simply dont have the time unfortunately.
The Cliff Notes version:
Sir Jack Brabham shows up at Indy in a Cooper-Climax. Gomers laugh at the 'funny-car'
The late Jim Clark and Colin Chapman show up at Indy a few years later in a 'funny-car' and promptly hand the gomers asses on a silver platter. Gomers are pissed.
Toney George wants control of C^RT, doesn't get it. Pulls tantrum.
End of story.
___________
Seriously though. The old USAC'ers have never forgotten or forgiven the road-racing nancy boys for the death of the front engined roadster.
Lizzerd
09-22-03, 02:28 PM
Hmmm... it's for a business class, eh? I'm not sure what you are looking for. Is it to discuss the split or the reasons for the split? Is it just the business state of OWR in the last decade without reference to IRL/CART? A contrast of the two series? I guess regardless, you really should begin with a short history lesson to help in describing the business structures of the two series.
Talk a bit about of the "European Invasion", beginning with Jack Brabham bringing his little rear engined car to compete in 1963 (?). Follow that with more of the rear engine revolution and the ultimate demise of the front engine cars.
Talk about the resultant rise in the cost to race and the blinders worn by USAC ("Indy is the only race that matters."). Continue with a discussion of Dan Gurney's White Paper and the formation of CART.
Talk about the rise in popularity of open wheel racing to the early '90's and that CART began to place less and less emphasis on the Indy 500 and more on their season championship and how this pissed off the powers at IMS enough to throw a hissy fit (IRL).
Now that you have established the differences in business structure of the two series, you're on your own. I never took any business classes.
Dan Gurney's White paper can be found here:
White Paper (http://www.allamericanracers.com/cart_white-paper.html)
Lizzerd
09-22-03, 02:29 PM
Oops... looks like mapguy was posting while I was typing. We're saying the same thing, basically.
Originally posted by Lizzerd
Oops... looks like mapguy was posting while I was typing. We're saying the same thing, basically.
Yes, but yours was more verbose and much more elegantly put.
:D
http://www.netaxs.com/~gg1/race/cartirl.htm
http://www.allamericanracers.com/cart_white-paper.html
Talk about the resultant rise in the cost to race and the blinders worn by USAC ("Indy is the only race that matters."). Continue with a discussion of Dan Gurney's White Paper and the formation of CART.
Talk about the rise in popularity of open wheel racing to the early '90's and that CART began to place less and less emphasis on the Indy 500 and more on their season championship and how this pissed off the powers at IMS enough to throw a hissy fit (IRL).
Now that you have established the differences in business structure of the two series, you're on your own. I never took any business classes.
...The more I think about it, the more I will probably begin with Dan Gurney's white paper. I can mention the "European invasion" relating more to drivers where the IRL is sold as a place for drivers to come out of sprints and midgets (which indirectly means American)...There was a quote from TG backing this in IndyStar articles in the mid-90's...I have to dig and find it.
Lizzerd
09-22-03, 05:34 PM
Originally posted by Chaos
...The more I think about it, the more I will probably begin with Dan Gurney's white paper. I can mention the "European invasion" relating more to drivers where the IRL is sold as a place for drivers to come out of sprints and midgets (which indirectly means American)...There was a quote from TG backing this in IndyStar articles in the mid-90's...I have to dig and find it.
Consider what confusion might be caused to a non-racing fan if you open with the White Paper without at least touching on a bit of the reason for its writing. Again, I'm thinking "business class". Maybe that's what you are saying you will do anyway...
Good luck, and I would enjoy reading your paper when it's completed.
nz_climber
09-22-03, 07:48 PM
My paper on History of OW racing:
tony has hissy fit
tony has vizzions
tony starts wanker league
tony kills OW racing
tony SUCKS
(this maynot be in order - can't do all the work for you ;))
:D
It's become really hard to get this sort of stuff on the web. Besides the links posted above, what you really want are Robin Miller's columns from the Indy Star. The Star used to have a section on their website devoted to historical articles about the split. But then they locked it all down beneath a subscription layer.
You might try e-mailing Robin (address somewhere at rpm.espn.com). Another guy would be Bill Koenig who was the motorsport business analyst at The Star. I don't know where he is these days though.
Another resource (with a much higher noise-to-signal ratio) is http://groups.google.com. You can search the rec.sport.auto.indy usenet discussions and might be able to find some gems if you're patient enough.
Other than that, I'm afraid it's off to the microfiche readers in the library for you, my friend. ;)
Here ya go Chaos, L1P1 & kids
the link to the speednet archives on the split (http://web.archive.org/web/19991115020156/speednet.starnews.com/speednet/irl/split.html)
Good stuff here.
BTW, don't know if racingstools is still up but it was another good site. Check over at CW, someone had talked about letting him transfer his pages over there.
Thanks cart7, I knew those existed but I thought The Star killed all of them by now (I had gotten many "Removed at request of..." messages)
But check this out...1991...I'm not sure about business class fodder, but it sure is interesting.
http://web.archive.org/web/19991115012709/speednet.starnews.com/speednet/irl/before/112991sn_endtalks.html
Oddly enough, I was also doing a research paper similar to Chaos. I can't remember exactly how I found it. I think I was doing a google archive search and stumbled on them. There is really good stuff in there especially RM interviews with participants of the 1991 meetings.
TG wanted it all and wasn't willing to bend an inch.
good call on archive.org...I never even thought to use that.
Originally posted by Lizzerd
Consider what confusion might be caused to a non-racing fan if you open with the White Paper without at least touching on a bit of the reason for its writing. Again, I'm thinking "business class". Maybe that's what you are saying you will do anyway...
Good luck, and I would enjoy reading your paper when it's completed.
My apologies for my vagueness in when saying 'business class'. It is a business management class. The requirements are to take a business case, analyse the management decisions (including their impacts and consequences). The OW racing split is a special case because you essentially have more than one entity in play here.
Anyway, I have to write a proposal first, and want to make sure I have enough resources to undertake this. It's looking ok so far.
nz_climber
09-23-03, 04:13 PM
Good luck Chaos - would be great to read it when your done :)
Originally posted by Chaos
...The more I think about it, the more I will probably begin with Dan Gurney's white paper. I can mention the "European invasion" relating more to drivers where the IRL is sold as a place for drivers to come out of sprints and midgets (which indirectly means American)...There was a quote from TG backing this in IndyStar articles in the mid-90's...I have to dig and find it.
Chaos, please note that had the Gurney White Paper been adopted in full and followed that many of the problems C^RT encountered would have been avoided. Also don't rule out the influx that Trans Am, Can AM and SCCA teams had on the direction CART and USAC took in the mid to late '70's.
Lizzerd
09-24-03, 05:54 PM
Originally posted by stymie
Also don't rule out the influx that Trans Am, Can AM and SCCA teams had on the direction CART and USAC took in the mid to late '70's.
Which was what? Really. Not slamming you, stymie, I'm just curious what influence you believe that TA, Can AM, and SCCA had on the direction CART and USAC took in the time period you mention, because I don't see that they did.
http://web.archive.org/web/20000118115834/speednet.starnews.com/indycar/96/may/0501sn_miller.html
Wow. Great stuff. :thumbup:
Originally posted by Lizzerd
Which was what? Really. Not slamming you, stymie, I'm just curious what influence you believe that TA, Can AM, and SCCA had on the direction CART and USAC took in the time period you mention, because I don't see that they did.
Those teams ran their teams like businesses. They were not interested only in winning, but also in making it financially prudent to do so. They wouldn't be caught dead bringing a car to the track in an open trailer.
Originally posted by Lizzerd
Which was what? Really. Not slamming you, stymie, I'm just curious what influence you believe that TA, Can AM, and SCCA had on the direction CART and USAC took in the time period you mention, because I don't see that they did.
Where did the teams come from that dominated C^RT and Indy in the 80's?
Well the influx of those teams included Penske, Haas, Hall and IIRC Patrick among others. They brought more professionalism as noted by JoeBob. They also developed or found the new vain of talent that had been ignored by most of USAC at that time the Road Racer. They were also more aggressive in advancing technology, maybe I should have said early 70’s, as that is when USAC created the chasm by splitting the Dirt tracks into their own series.
DjDrOmusic
09-24-03, 06:29 PM
Business Paper:
The Split in North Americas Open Wheel Racing
It was a dark stormy night, and the boy sitting on the 5 gallon dispenser filled with Kool Aid, had his face buried in a bag of white powder, suddenly, he had a vision....:p :gomer:
Lizzerd
09-24-03, 06:39 PM
Thanks JoeBob and stymie. Makes sense now, and I should have realized what you meant the first time, stymie. You are right.
It may be getting kinda deep, though. Depends on the word length requirements of the afore mentioned paper.
Heck, if we all put our heads together we could write a friggin book!
Lizzerd
09-24-03, 06:47 PM
Originally posted by DjDrOmusic
Business Paper:
The Split in North Americas Open Wheel Racing
It was a dark stormy night, and the boy sitting on the 5 gallon dispenser filled with Kool Aid, had his face buried in a bag of white powder, suddenly, he had a vision....:p :gomer:
Methinks there was more than Kool-Aid and white powder involved. It took a lot more than that to give me "visions" back in the '80's. Of course, I wasn't sitting on a multi-billion dollar empire inheritance, either.
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