View Full Version : Hemelgarn?
Another site is saying that Hemelgarn Racing is coming to OWRS with Reynard chassis?
Tell me this is a joke. Are we that desperate that for field fillers?
Maybe slobud lazier will finally get his deserved champcar ride..... :laugh:
Madmaxfan2
03-19-04, 05:30 PM
Hell will freeze first.
That would be TFF. Imagine Buddy Lazier finding his natural level of futility again at the back of a Champcar field.
Hemelgarn is one of the now crumbling cornerstone teams of the IRL. It would be a small and useless victory to have them in Champcar again, since Hemelgarn couldn't even run a decent team in the early years of the IRL.
Sounds good to me.
With the hyperspace button and a few backmarkers thrown into the mix, it may make for better racing and provide more opportunities for the leaders to overtake one another.
Lapped traffic is one thing that champ car has lacked the last few years. The parity in the series has lead to a very competitive field all the way up and down the grid making nearly impossible to pass in the tight confines of a street circuit.
If life gives you lemons, make lemonade.
Firestorm
03-19-04, 06:16 PM
I don't know diddlysquat about Hemelgarn as I don't waste my time watching the IRL, but it seems to me no matter what they were like over there, a fresh start for them would be a positive move. If Honduh and Toyo want to poach the worst of our team owners then turnabout is fair play.
Even if they stink, every series needs its Minardis and Jordans. And last year Champcars already had those yellow Jordan-like cars, so Hemelgarn can be our Minardi. Hey, isn't 'Jos the Boss' available? :D
So bring 'em on!
:thumdown:
Im sticking by my guns. Bloody was a cheerleader and reminded all that even Daddy's deep pockets could not turn the trick in CART. Dont know much about some of the new rookies, but never saw them chugging Kool Aid either.......
He was a Newman/Haas test driver one time, so I think that if Haas runs more than a couple of cars at the Speedway, with some persusion from The Idiot Grandson, and a favor to the Lemming faithfull, He would get a third seat in a Haas Cr@pwagon
Ziggy
Hard Driver
03-19-04, 07:11 PM
Are we that desperate that for field fillers?
Do you want an honest answer?
Racing Truth
03-21-04, 01:04 PM
Some here are missing the tremendous PR opportunity this would bring. Forsythe and the boys were rumored to be considering a RICO lawsuit against IRL/Honda, partially I suspect, to shine a light on what a fraud the "vision was, and to give TG some neg. press for once. Again, no doubt just a rumor, but...
That said, an original IRL team defecting for cost reasons would be a much easier way of making a statement like that. Also, it's one more car.
We'll see though.
Railbird
03-21-04, 01:14 PM
I'll talk to someone this week who should be able to shed a little light on this rumor.
My 2 cents: if Hemelgarn comes it will be with a ride buyer from IPS.
Now if I can dig up an old '96 Indy tape I'll have to jot down Hemelgarn's rant on how TG was in the process of saving Indy for the little guys.
How many days until the first of April?
I believe I read an interview with him a couple years ago when the earl costs started really escalating, that'd he'd go back to Cart and race if it was cheaper. Apparently the "low cost, little guy saviour" act TG ran a few years there at the beginning was wearing a little thin on Ron.
It would be pretty cool if Hemelgarn came to champcars with say, Richie Hearn! I would hate for them to show up with Mart Roth or someone like that....But, I don't really expect them to be on the grid at LBC.
First, it's arrogance that got us in this mess in the first place, so let’s not repeat the past. If Hemelgarn, or anyone else from the IRL, wants to join us, hold the door open for them.
Second, the nobodies who were originally in the IRL are the only people involved in this fiasco that, I think, believed what they were saying. They have been rewarded with the back of Boy George’s hand. Hemelgarn has good reason for wanting to see the competition succeed.
BTW, SpeedChannel is reporting that OWRS is courting Hemelgard.
Madmaxfan2
03-22-04, 09:21 AM
So OWRS is courting Hemelgarn. I still think that Hemelgarn won't turn and go.
It was Hemelgarn and Buddy Lazier that provided the first IRL Indy 500 win back in 1996, a beneficury of the US 500. TG will probably bankroll a backmarker INDY 500 program for Hemelgarn to keep him in the fold.
Wolverine
03-22-04, 10:04 AM
Are we that desperate that for field fillers?
Yes.
Racewriter
03-22-04, 10:16 AM
First, it's arrogance that got us in this mess in the first place, so let’s not repeat the past. If Hemelgarn, or anyone else from the IRL, wants to join us, hold the door open for them.
Second, the nobodies who were originally in the IRL are the only people involved in this fiasco that, I think, believed what they were saying. They have been rewarded with the back of Boy George’s hand. Hemelgarn has good reason for wanting to see the competition succeed.
BTW, SpeedChannel is reporting that OWRS is courting Hemelgard.
Nice post. Ron has done a lot for the IRL. In fact, when the "Road to Indy" thing was still being promoted, Ron did a bunch of tests for USAC guys, and even sponsored a USAC race in Toledo where the winner got a free IRL test.
He was one of the few owners at the beginning who would take a show car around at his own expense to promote the league. Now he's gotten it in the shorts, while guys like Rahal (who actively worked to kill the IRL) get freebie engines and TonyBucks. If Ron went to ChampCar, I'd say it's because he's righteously pissed off.
Madmaxfan2
03-22-04, 12:07 PM
Is Ron Hemelgard Pissed at the IRL? I just do not see it. Some of those old USAC-IRL types may have been duped, but will those guys actually admit it publically? I just do not see it. I envision those types retreating back to the USAC racing world, never to venture back into the IRL.
Ron had a Silver Crown car entered in the Copper this weekend so I am sure he had an audience with Tony for the weekend.
Racing Truth
03-22-04, 01:51 PM
If TG had any sense (hehe, sorry :D ), he would actually give TonyBucks to a Hemelgarn, Schmidt, PDM, etc. I have no probably, given OW's current issues, with either series subsidizing teams. In fact, given IMS' deep pockets, it would be the sensible thing to do.
Chitowncartfreak
03-22-04, 05:39 PM
First, we could use the cars.
Second, I don't think anyone ever said that Buddy Lazier would be the driver. There seems to be plenty of worthy drivers walking around looking for a seat. I hope Ron is bringing good sponsorship and isn't looking for a handout.
Third, it would be a good bit of PR to have one of the original IRL teams, having been screwed over by the "vision", back in ChampCar. Who would you rather have - Hemelgarn, Foyt, or Cheever?
First, we could use the cars.
Second, I don't think anyone ever said that Buddy Lazier would be the driver. There seems to be plenty of worthy drivers walking around looking for a seat. I hope Ron is bringing good sponsorship and isn't looking for a handout.
Third, it would be a good bit of PR to have one of the original IRL teams, having been screwed over by the "vision", back in ChampCar. Who would you rather have - Hemelgarn, Foyt, or Cheever?
Foyt.
At least the name will mean something.
Foyt.
At least the name will mean something.
Wow. Then we could have the Futility Watch in the Champcar forum. :eek:
formulaben
03-23-04, 12:18 AM
It would be pretty cool if Hemelgarn came to champcars with say, Richie Hearn!
I've always thought that Richie didn't get a fair shake before.
RICO lawsuit against IRL/Honda.
:confused: I'm not all that familiar with legal terminology. What exactly does this mean?
:confused: I'm not all that familiar with legal terminology. What exactly does this mean?
That's a federal law for prosecuting racketeering and conspiracy.
Jervis Tetch 1
03-23-04, 11:40 AM
I'll believe it when I see it (Hemelgarn coming to OWRS).
Joe in LA
03-23-04, 12:50 PM
:confused: I'm not all that familiar with legal terminology. What exactly does this mean?
RICO=Racketeering and Corrupt Organizations Act. It was originally the "anti-Mafia" law. Basically it is a federal statute that allows civil lawsuits and criminal prosecutions of individuals or organizations that conspire with each other for an illegal purpose. So, if two companies agree to work together to do something illegal, they could be sued or prosecuted under RICO for simply conspiring, rather than for the underlying illegal act--i.e. it makes the conspiracy itself illegal. So, in classic application, being a member of the "mafia" is illegal, even if you don't commit another crime.
Nosuchsoul
03-23-04, 01:07 PM
No, no, no! It means your Rico Suave!
No, no, no! It means your Rico Suave!
http://hometown.aol.com/film114/gerardo.jpg
lone_groover
03-23-04, 05:47 PM
Si me enterno, you me enfermo.....
:cry:
:gomer:
:)
l_g, I wish you'd save that fancy stuff for the French board. :gomer: :D
Railbird
03-24-04, 05:36 PM
I've been as skeptical as anyone about this one, but
The crew has been told to get ready to go to Long Beach.
Forsythe is prepping one of the ASTJ Reynards for them to take.
theunions
03-24-04, 05:56 PM
The crew has been told to get ready to go to Long Beach.
With Hearn?
With Hearn?
With Hearn, I might even root for Hemelgarn to get a top 10...
The other might be just a season of Buddy L. jokes.
ShickStift
03-24-04, 06:04 PM
Hemelgarn + Hearn + Reynard, god can you get a better package? All we need is for them to roll out 1998 era Goodyear tyres!
I propose we rename them 'Team Afterthought'
Racing Truth
03-24-04, 06:44 PM
I've been as skeptical as anyone about this one, but
The crew has been told to get ready to go to Long Beach.
Forsythe is prepping one of the ASTJ Reynards for them to take.
Wow. :eek:
Will it be with Hearn?
Racing Truth
03-24-04, 06:45 PM
Hemelgarn + Hearn + Reynard, god can you get a better package? All we need is for them to roll out 1998 era Goodyear tyres!
I propose we rename them 'Team Afterthought'
One more car and a potential PR coup. More positive to me.
I think calling it a PR coup is stretching it a bit.
Railbird
03-24-04, 08:43 PM
No idea who the driver will be othar than I would imagine it's the series' call since they are paying the frieght.
If the field looks like:
PT
Bourdais
Vasser
Junky
Carp
Tag
Dominguez
RHR
Jourdain
Allmendinger
Firman
Wilson
and maybe Haberfeld
I'll put up with the Lavins/Phillipes/Gonzalez/washed up American teams of the world.
The boys promised us eightteen at Long Beach and they are well on the way to delivering
Spicoli
03-25-04, 12:47 AM
Well, I know its an American (which is cool) and I have heard Hearn, TBell (also Conquest is talking to him? ) and even Laziers.
I was told their sponsorship was big money, and required an American driver.
but was told the driver never drove in EARL. One who raced in CART before, and never in EARL..
So that makes it Hearn or Tball.
I just can't see TBell the Metrosexual with big ole Tendeloin eatin' Ron :saywhat: Talk about polar opposites. :eek:
We'll know soon man
devilmaster
03-25-04, 12:50 AM
One who raced in CART before, and never in EARL..
So that makes it Hearn or Tball.
Someone correct me if i'm wrong, but didn't Hearn run in the earl for a bit?
:confused:
Steve
I thought Hearn came over here with Della Penna after running IRL for a year
Lizzerd
03-25-04, 12:56 AM
Split his time between the two in '96, if I remember right.
Yes, Hearn was with DellaPenna in the IRL in 1996 and with either Sam Schmidt or Treadway in somewhere around 2002 I think.
Jervis Tetch 1
03-25-04, 11:58 AM
Hearn had four starts in the I*L last year, two with Hemelgarn and one each iwth Menard and Sam Schmidt. He took the pole at Chicago with Menard.
Hearn won the IRL race in Las Vegas back in 1996. He's also run a few other IRL races in the not too distant past.
Spicoli
03-25-04, 02:10 PM
On another forum, someone contacted RH, and said he has no idea about the ride, but would surely consider it.
Hmmmmm.....please God, no Laziers. :confused:
who does FatRon run in his IpSe car?
Spicoli
03-25-04, 02:12 PM
RH = Richie, not Ron ;)
theunions
03-25-04, 02:24 PM
who does FatRon run in his IpSe car?
Paul Dana is in the #91; the #92 is vacant until a paying driver is found.
lone_groover
03-25-04, 02:28 PM
Paul Dana is in the #91; the #92 is vacant until a paying driver is found.
:thumbup:I loved the old José Jimenez routine. :thumbup:
:)
:thumbup:I loved the old José Jimenez routine. :thumbup:
:)
Q: Is that a crash helmet?
A: I hope not!
:)
Man on the street told me that Tony is fully aware of this notion. I guess right now Hemelgarn is waiting for an offer to stay in Cr@pwagon. One may be coming. Ole' Ron figures if he plays his cards right, somebody else will pay for his racing. (which is just the way it has to be for this greaseball)
Ziggy
Railbird
03-26-04, 08:58 PM
How about this Zig?
If you're sitting in an empty raceshop with a show car or two why wouldn;t you russle up a half dozen old team shirts and take a photo of your buddies standing around looking like they're working on the sled.
"leak" the pic to spyplane and drop a press release about looking forward to the debute of some nancy boy or another at Long Beach.
Voila!
a check from TG is in the mail the next day.
Spicoli
03-27-04, 08:43 AM
RailBird may be on to something here. I mean, how happy would Ron be eating Lobster and sipping Champagne. South korea - aren't we still mad at them?
Ron is an UberGomer. He's happy with a T'loin and a plate of rings from the Workingman's Friend.
Yeah - ron is going to ChampCar - he's following the lead of FAF & FBR and using ChampCar to get some TBA funding.
But the more FTG keeps opening his wallet, the more I like it. 'Specially in this case.
Gangrel
03-27-04, 09:00 AM
South korea - aren't we still mad at them?
That would be North Korea. It's called a newspaper! Read a newspaper! :D
Spicoli
03-27-04, 02:50 PM
That would be North Korea. It's called a newspaper! Read a newspaper! :D
sorry, it was early, and I was trying put myself in gomer shoes. :gomer:
But gomers often make mistakes, so - I guess I'm ok.
so when did the scientific community discover the ability for gomers to recognize the existence of other lands far far away? like beyond the boundaries of Indianapolis City Limits :eek:
JLMannin
03-29-04, 12:59 PM
so when did the scientific community discover the ability for gomers to recognize the existence of other lands far far away? like beyond the boundaries of Indianapolis City Limits :eek:
Gomers are far more worldly that you give them credit for. They have extensive knowledge about cities and communities spanning all the way to the Marion county line!!
Madmaxfan2
03-29-04, 02:39 PM
Didn't the original Gomer joined the USMC and see the world? ;)
:confused: I'm not all that familiar with legal terminology. What exactly does this mean?
RICO statute (http://graham.main.nc.us/~bhammel/INS/RICO.html)
Essentially racketeering through bribery. Would be a huge leap to prove the linkage, IMHO.
-Kevin
I don't know diddlysquat about Hemelgarn as I don't waste my time watching the IRL, but it seems to me no matter what they were like over there, a fresh start for them would be a positive move. If Honduh and Toyo want to poach the worst of our team owners then turnabout is fair play.
The worst of former C^RT owners? That's rich. How many championships did the likes of Penske, Rahal, and Cheep win? Andretti? I'm pissed royally @ Rahal and Fernandez, but they are far from the likes of Coyne.
Anyway, I'll believe it when I see Hemelgarn Racing @ LBGP, and I'm not holding my breath. CCWS cannot build a foundation with the likes of teams like that. RuSports and Herdez, yes, but not Hemelgarn.
-Kevin
formulaben
03-30-04, 02:45 AM
CCWS cannot build a foundation with the likes of teams like that. RuSports and Herdez, yes, but not Hemelgarn.
-Kevin
I think the foundation is already set. It's the car count they're working on now, and as far as I'm concerned, the first "gomer" we get to come over to our side, could be the first domino, which could lead to GOOD things. I won't say it's better than nothing, because I still remember a certain driver (http://www.deepthrottle.com/scorecard.shtml) that was worse than nothing...but it's a start. And even if he doesn't come, then it must be because TG is funding his crapwagon season.
;)
<<That's rich. >>There's one I haven't heard in a while. ;)
<<<There's one I haven't heard in a while. ;)>>>
:rofl:
lone_groover
03-30-04, 11:59 AM
HA HA!
:D
the first "gomer" we get to come over to our side, could be the first domino, which could lead to GOOD things.
;)
Wasn't Conquest the first "gomer" to our side?
Della Penna probably was the first, back in 1996. He ran the full IRL Schedule (including a win at Las Vegas) along with selected CART Races (Toronto, LB, and Laguna Seca, IIRC). For 1997, he switched to CART full time. The next IRL to CART switch would be Conquest.
I see Conquest as a returnee, rather than a defector. The Alessandro Zampedri Mi-Jack entry at Indy was a Dick Simon car, IIRC. Eric B was a CART driver and started an Indy Lights team after retiring at the end of the 1995 season. His intention all along was to run CART. He just couldn't afford it yet.
Railbird
04-01-04, 06:11 AM
sounds like the bluff worked.
Hemelgarn is making plans for Indy.
No flaming refuels at Long Beach
Madmaxfan2
04-01-04, 10:54 AM
Not suprising Railbird, It only proves how insecure TG is. Imagine a marignal "player" successfully shaking down a competent business executive.
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