Penske Defends IRL Path

[racer2c]

So he says Adrian and Raholes move heled validate his decision to go to the IRL in '01. I'm assuming that the lack of fans in the stands were aiding in his opinion. Now he is telling ChampCar to come over and "race with the best". Link (http://www.speedtv.com/articles/auto/indycar/10324/)

[Madmaxfan2]

Well, what's new? I think he protests too much.

[DaveL]

The statements of car owners in either series simply cannot be taken seriously. They have proven their ability to lie time and again. If someone threw enough money at Pimpski or Mikey tomorrow to come to Champ Cars in time for Long Beach they'd be be there singing hosannas to the series.

For now I don't expect anything else out of Pimpski or any other members of the Fifth Column. I find it ridiculous that they talk about how CART was going down when they were the very reason it was. It's akin to someone deliberately opening up the sea valves on a ship and then saying they don't want to be on a sinking ship.

[Brickman]

The statements of car owners in either series simply cannot be taken seriously. They have proven their ability to lie time and again. If someone threw enough money at Pimpski or Mikey tomorrow to come to Champ Cars in time for Long Beach they'd be be there singing hosannas to the series.

For now I don't expect anything else out of Pimpski or any other members of the Fifth Column. I find it ridiculous that they talk about how CART was going down when they were the very reason it was. It's akin to someone deliberately opening up the sea valves on a ship and then saying they don't want to be on a sinking ship.

It's a manufacturer thing from the get go. Honda, Toyota, Chevy could rebuild Champ Car and take the IRL to it's knees the same way. Yen or dollars doesn't make a difference, they are as bad for the IRL as they were for CART.

Racing is business and until someone in open wheel grows some brain cells we will all do it again someday. It's the system that sucks. People keep blaming Penske, Ganassi, Andretti, Rahal, Fernandez, Nunn, Patrick, but it's the system of manufacturer dollars that makes or breaks a series.

What? No one listened to Murph?

[racer2c]

In the article, Rog mentions tire support. Hmm. Do you think that the IRL is not only going after tracks, teams, drivers and sponsors, but also trying push Bridgstone into ending their ChampCar support?

[lone_groover]

It's my policy not to be hatin' on pimps. BUT, even a playa has to follow some ethics - even if they are his own.

Captain Pervert has none.

:thumdown:

[Steve99]

With no TV contract . . .

What's this doing in that article?

[DaveL]

It's a manufacturer thing from the get go. Honda, Toyota, Chevy could rebuild Champ Car and take the IRL to it's knees the same way. Yen or dollars doesn't make a difference, they are as bad for the IRL as they were for CART.


For once we agree.

The sport got along just fine for decades with the Yen and dollars being thrown around by auto mfgs. The involvement of the mfgs has been the worst thing that has ever happened to this sport. And no mfg ever stays in a series for the long haul, with some notable exceptions in F1. So when T&H decide to move on to other things, so long IRL.

[Jervis Tetch 1]

Bingo guys. After T&H leaves does anyone REALLY believe that GM will rescue TG?

[Brickman]

For once we agree.

The sport got along just fine for decades with the Yen and dollars being thrown around by auto mfgs. The involvement of the mfgs has been the worst thing that has ever happened to this sport. And no mfg ever stays in a series for the long haul, with some notable exceptions in F1. So when T&H decide to move on to other things, so long IRL.

We agree more often than you think.

So when did the yen tossing screw things up the most?

IMHO In 2000 with Ganassi. The race for the dollars and ultimate direction of the sport was set in motion from there.

[Brickman]

Bingo guys. After T&H leaves does anyone REALLY believe that GM will rescue TG?

Of course not. History repeats itself.

[rabbit]

Link (http://www.speedtv.com/articles/auto/indycar/10324/)

"I don’t want to be put in a position where I’m assuming they don’t have a chance," Penske said.Whatever happened to "There will only be one open wheel series in 18 months," Mr. Peniske? :saywhat: :p

[Insomniac]

Whatever happened to "There will only be one open wheel series in 18 months," Mr. Peniske? :saywhat: :p

He keeps saying that every year at Indy. ;)

[Insomniac]

We agree more often than you think.

So when did the yen tossing screw things up the most?

IMHO In 2000 with Ganassi. The race for the dollars and ultimate direction of the sport was set in motion from there.

I agree it was when Chip took money to run the unproven Toyotas. Before teams wanted to win and wanted the best. They'd probably undercut, but free engines and/or money to run them.

[Turn7]

Penske has spent gazillions to win the last three straight Gomer Fair 500's to zero fanfair from the media.

Sort of like, "if a tree falls in the woods and nobody is around does it make a noise?". He will increase his blather and bleating until somebody pretends to listen.

He has 2 more years before he loses his sponsorship and is trying to make the most of it.

It will be very interesting to see if he still highrolls it with Penske Auto Center/UAG as the primary sponsor after Marlboro money goes up in smoke.

[Brickman]

Penske has spent gazillions to win the last three straight Gomer Fair 500's to zero fanfair from the media.

Sort of like, "if a tree falls in the woods and nobody is around does it make a noise?". He will increase his blather and bleating until somebody pretends to listen.

He has 2 more years before he loses his sponsorship and is trying to make the most of it.

It will be very interesting to see if he still highrolls it with Penske Auto Center/UAG as the primary sponsor after Marlboro money goes up in smoke.

Penske knew what we all knew, once Toyota was going the game would change. So he brought out the black cars and ran Chevy power, getting prepared for Toyota. Getting Marlboro back at the 500 was easy. I don't think he will have trouble getting sponsors UNTIL Toyota leaves. Then in my opinion they will all be S.O.L.

[fourrunner]

All Penske, Ganassi, and the other "Frauds" had to say was NO WE"RE NOT SWITCHING, and the IRL would be History now

To Let These owners off the hook by blaming the manufacturers is pure poppycock.

Penske especially built a strong Business outside of Racing by making "Tough Decisions". To think that they all of a sudden are beholden to the Manufacturers is rediculous.

The facts are he wanted to be top dog on someone elses dime, and he went the easy way.

He is the Root Cause of CARTS problems, saying one thing, while doing another. He trained the other Wannabe's that followed wonderfully !

He is an embarrassment to "Legitimate" Racing in his dealings!

[RichK]

Right on, fourrunner.

[Brickman]

All Penske, Ganassi, and the other "Frauds" had to say was NO WE"RE NOT SWITCHING, and the IRL would be History now



Not quite.

They weren't in it before and they rolled along.

What would have happened is Toyota and Honda would have thrown their money at IRL teams and Penske and Ganassi would look more like Forsythe's racing team now.

[cart7]

........ I don't think he will have trouble getting sponsors UNTIL Toyota leaves. Then in my opinion they will all be S.O.L.
I believe I read an interview with John Barnes recently where he basically said the earl is dropping the ball on promotion and building league identity. The irl needs to build it's identity so corporate America knows it exists else they'll be trouble in paradise when current sponsors and/or engine manufacturers start leaving because of it.

Seeings how he'll probably lose the Pennzoil deal before Pimpski loses Marlboro, I'd say he's the first of the big time earl owners to see the handwriting on the wall.

[pchall]

Penske has spent gazillions to win the last three straight Gomer Fair 500's to zero fanfair from the media.

Sort of like, "if a tree falls in the woods and nobody is around does it make a noise?". He will increase his blather and bleating until somebody pretends to listen.

He has 2 more years before he loses his sponsorship and is trying to make the most of it.

It will be very interesting to see if he still highrolls it with Penske Auto Center/UAG as the primary sponsor after Marlboro money goes up in smoke.


Penske pulled the plug on Penske Auto Centers last year. Funny thing was there was a really cheesily done commercial aired during the first couple of IRL shows last season and then they were all closed. I've heard that UAG isn't doing all that well either.

[fourrunner]

Not quite.

They weren't in it before and they rolled along.

What would have happened is Toyota and Honda would have thrown their money at IRL teams and Penske and Ganassi would look more like Forsythe's racing team now.


You are stating that Penske and Ganassi have no Power to determine their fate. Well if your right then they are no different than Dale Coyne, or Eric Bachelart. Penske HAD great influence he just played their game.

Without Penske .. Honda & Toyota putting their money on the likes of Menard, and Sam Schmidt Racing is specious at best. One year and done. WHO WOULD CARE.

Heck they've put their money behind Penske & Ganassi and no one cares or they wouldn't be selling 2 for 1 tickets.

Penske was at odds with CART Management and he thought he'd kill the series by switching. He Didn't ... Same for Ganassi and the Retarded Andretti progeny... none succeeded, and hardly anyone followed them Fan Wise

The IRL is being propped up and bought... but still no one cares

Is CART injured .... absolutely but for all the fakery ... No one cares about the IRL either.

Penske just had to say NO your wrong Toyota & Honda. Chevy would switch, Ford was there. Wow American Named Engines in CART against Japanese Engines in the All Oval, All American IRL, What Irony.

Killing CART / OWRS has been like getting direct hits by millions of mahine gun bullets , shot after shot, but OWRS still gets up.

[Wally]

fourrunner, your on a roll bro!! :thumbup:

[Brickman]

You are stating that Penske and Ganassi have no Power to determine their fate. Well if your right then they are no different than Dale Coyne, or Eric Bachelart. Penske HAD great influence he just played their game.

Without Penske .. Honda & Toyota putting their money on the likes of Menard, and Sam Schmidt Racing is specious at best. One year and done. WHO WOULD CARE.

Heck they've put their money behind Penske & Ganassi and no one cares or they wouldn't be selling 2 for 1 tickets.

Penske was at odds with CART Management and he thought he'd kill the series by switching. He Didn't ... Same for Ganassi and the Retarded Andretti progeny... none succeeded, and hardly anyone followed them Fan Wise

The IRL is being propped up and bought... but still no one cares

Is CART injured .... absolutely but for all the fakery ... No one cares about the IRL either.

Penske just had to say NO your wrong Toyota & Honda. Chevy would switch, Ford was there. Wow American Named Engines in CART against Japanese Engines in the All Oval, All American IRL, What Irony.

Killing CART / OWRS has been like getting direct hits by millions of mahine gun bullets , shot after shot, but OWRS still gets up.

I respectfully disagree.

We are in the business of being fans, pretty simple job, contribute criticisims or plaudits on forums, support the sponsors that support the series, and buy shirts, hats, tickets to the races we go to. I do, you do too.

Their job isn't so easy, they must get results and get money. Making the sponsor happy, and their pocketbook happy. Because of the poor system that CART was based on it was inevitable that IF the manufacturers bolted that the teams would too. Going public guaranteed that. It was basic economics.

I doubt that if you can't stand Microsoft and Bill Gates, no one quits there job and hires on with Apple for thousands and thousands less. It's NOT about principles, it's about money. I would agree that Penske assets (ISC stock) add to his interest in the IRL.

As far as Ganassi and the rest of the lot I believe that indeed IF they hadn't gone with Toyota or Honda that indeed other IRL teams would have stepped in. Would they be at the same level as Penske is? No. Would they need to be? No. Schmidt's driver lapped the whole field in the IPS snoozer this weekend. Toyota would be happy with those results.

The flip side is where Forsythe is now. As pointed out by others, no sponsor exists and he's got the 2003 CART Champion! Ganassi, Rahal, Penske would have been trying to lure every Lavin, Dominguez, any driver with a check in their back pocket. Dog eat dog kind of world.

I will agree that the IRL is propped up, but I have noticed something different this weekend, the demographics are changing. I have been to every open wheel race at Phoenix since 1990. I use to camp in the lot and was the only person with a camper instead of a 32' RV/Trailer. I was to every one with the exception of... get this, 1996 because of the IRL replacing CART, just being honest. For the first time the demographics are changing, young soul patched, long sideburned, beer drinking kids are replacing the old school fans. It wasn't the Copper Classic coat tails, fewer fans of them are there on Saturday, IPS race must have scared them away.

Chalk it up to propping up, Marlboro tickets, Indy Girls worth looking at, marketing, whatever you want. 1995 levels again??? I would say no.

[Racing Truth]

I believe I read an interview with John Barnes recently where he basically said the earl is dropping the ball on promotion and building league identity. The irl needs to build it's identity so corporate America knows it exists else they'll be trouble in paradise when current sponsors and/or engine manufacturers start leaving because of it.

Seeings how he'll probably lose the Pennzoil deal before Pimpski loses Marlboro, I'd say he's the first of the big time earl owners to see the handwriting on the wall.

Ahhh, IRL marketing. That's what we call an oxymoron. Not that CART was any better mind you, esp, the last few years.

[Racing Truth]

I will agree that the IRL is propped up, but I have noticed something different this weekend, the demographics are changing. I have been to every open wheel race at Phoenix since 1990. I use to camp in the lot and was the only person with a camper instead of a 32' RV/Trailer. I was to every one with the exception of... get this, 1996 because of the IRL replacing CART, just being honest. For the first time the demographics are changing, young soul patched, long sideburned, beer drinking kids are replacing the old school fans. It wasn't the Copper Classic coat tails, fewer fans of them are there on Saturday, IPS race must have scared them away.

Chalk it up to propping up, Marlboro tickets, Indy Girls worth looking at, marketing, whatever you want. 1995 levels again??? I would say no.

With those Indy Girls, I just further believe that the IRL is trying to be CART II. Of course, they won't get many, if any, CART fans, and that's their essential problem.

[Insomniac]

All Penske, Ganassi, and the other "Frauds" had to say was NO WE"RE NOT SWITCHING, and the IRL would be History now

To Let These owners off the hook by blaming the manufacturers is pure poppycock.

Penske especially built a strong Business outside of Racing by making "Tough Decisions". To think that they all of a sudden are beholden to the Manufacturers is rediculous.

The facts are he wanted to be top dog on someone elses dime, and he went the easy way.

He is the Root Cause of CARTS problems, saying one thing, while doing another. He trained the other Wannabe's that followed wonderfully !

He is an embarrassment to "Legitimate" Racing in his dealings!

If they didn't go the IRL would be the same way it was before T&H went. They'd be running for much less than ChampCar. Then the "top" IRL teams would have T&H engines instead of the traitors.

Either way, I don't think anything can happen that would stop TG from keeping the IRL alive as long as he can.

[jcollins28]

Good, In a few years when the IRL folds. Then Penske should be happy that he at least has his NASCAR team.