View Full Version : Race Coverage stunk
RaceGrrl
07-25-04, 06:16 PM
WTF happened today? There was a race on? Hell, you wouldn't have known it by the first 45 minutes of so-called coverage. I was pissed for the first hour of the broadcast because there was so little actual race coverage. I don't know how you'd have known what was going on if you started watching halfway through because the scrolling position graphics were few and far between.
At least Rick Benjamin knows the names of the teams and drivers now, but get one thing straight: the race cars have ENGINES, not motors.
Today's coverage gets a D- from me. :flame:
I liked it, it kept me and three friends interested. There was a slip or two by that new pit reporter, but the Bronte segments were awesome :thumbup: . True, it wasn't the best telecast, but it was very good, just a few mistakes.
Rogue Leader
07-25-04, 06:29 PM
While its not gonna be perfect IMO this season, that coverage was almost as good as the rest of the season so far. There were some bobbles with the intros with Bronte but otherwise i thought eveyrthing was fine, and things felt much more professional and "event like" now.
Opposite Lock
07-25-04, 06:30 PM
When Bronte comes on, mute the tv, un-mute camera 1 on RD.
When the tv goes back to racing, reverse the above.
nz_climber
07-25-04, 06:36 PM
there was a race??? with no race director and no chat working... i wouldn't have clue what happened today - so just feel lucky you folks actually got to see the race!
:flame:
Ruben Barrios
07-25-04, 06:37 PM
They're actually called motors in some parts of the world ;)
Did they ever really clarify whether the start was officially supposed to be single file or two wide? Starts in Vancouver are usually pretty sloppy because of the chicane, but it would really suck for the fans if they decided single file.
Rogue Leader
07-25-04, 06:51 PM
Did they ever really clarify whether the start was officially supposed to be single file or two wide? Starts in Vancouver are usually pretty sloppy because of the chicane, but it would really suck for the fans if they decided single file.
supposed to be single because it was a green/yellow start thanks to Movingchicane putting himself into a wall.
I saw bits of all 3 races on TV today, and I thought SPIKE had the best coverage. Who is Bill Adam? (Another) New guy in the pits, and he did a decent job.
The only real fault would be that the Gidley feature could have waited for a yellow, but I'll still take this broadcast crew over everything else out there.
A bad race by the HDNet/Spike crew is still far and above the best some of the other "TV Partners" can offer.
RaceGrrl
07-25-04, 07:01 PM
33 minutes of actual race coverage in the first hour. That's pretty lame.
I saw bits of all 3 races on TV today, and I thought SPIKE had the best coverage. Who is Bill Adam? (Another) New guy in the pits, and he did a decent job.
.
Bill Adam raced IMSA GTP back in the day. He's also been announcing sports car races for quite some time.
33 minutes of actual race coverage in the first hour. That's pretty lame.
Well last year there would have been a lot more complaining about lack of commercials and CART not making any $$$ yadda yadda yadda... Hey, Honda even threw in an IRL Ad. :thumbup:
RaceGrrl
07-25-04, 07:24 PM
Well last year there would have been a lot more complaining about lack of commercials and CART not making any $$$ yadda yadda yadda... Hey, Honda even threw in an IRL Ad. :thumbup:
Oh please. :rolleyes:
Sean O'Gorman
07-25-04, 07:39 PM
:cry:
Due to my carelessness I screwed up recording of the race for the second time this season.
Ed_Severson
07-25-04, 07:43 PM
At least Rick Benjamin knows the names of the teams and drivers now, but get one thing straight: the race cars have ENGINES, not motors.
If you're complaining about that, there must not be much else to gripe about.
I watched the whole race, and here's the best part ... I didn't want to shoot myself or anybody else afterwards. Further, I wasn't at all confused about what was going on, and not once did I notice something in the timing scroll that made me ask myself "how in hell did that happen?"
Could they have shown more racing? Sure. Could they have done that and still managed to give average viewers a few glimpses of what it's like at the track? I doubt it. The thing you have to remember is this -- they're not televising a race. They're televising a sporting event. Every network that covers sports does it, and until Champ Car has networks lining up to air their races, Spike is going to do it too.
There are only two better ways to watch the race -- use Race Director or buy a ticket.
This seemed like a pretty acceptable third option.
Oh please. :rolleyes:
Nice comeback :rofl:
Seriously though, last year we were all complaining about the only two main tv-advertisers, Ford and Bridgestone. ;)
It's really been the first bad race. Had no idea there was anybody out there but PT with the exception of pit stops. You win some you lose some, this one was a loser. Next one won't be. :thumdown:
Opposite Lock
07-25-04, 08:45 PM
I saw bits of all 3 races on TV today,...
Champ Car, Tour de France, and Superbikes at Mid-Ohio?
Or were you referring to ALMS? Or possibly Formula Ferrari?
'Cause I know you weren't talkin' Louden or Milwaukee. :D
pfc_m_drake
07-25-04, 08:57 PM
I'll say this - on Spike there were a ton of commercials. Now, I understand that's a fire and ice situation; you want people to buy commercials for your broadcast but then, of course, you have to air those commercials.
I don't have issues with the broadcast team, the camera angles, the overall coverage, or anything on the production side of things. I don't even really mind commercials. Maybe they're just missing somebody in the truck with a little race savey to point out when it's a good time for commercial breaks.
Railbird
07-25-04, 09:39 PM
I don't have issues with the broadcast team, the camera angles, the overall coverage, or anything on the production side of things. I don't even really mind commercials. Maybe they're just missing somebody in the truck with a little race savey to point out when it's a good time for commercial breaks.
Someone should send this quote off to "beetlejuice"
Lizzerd
07-25-04, 09:48 PM
I watched the whole race, and here's the best part ... I didn't want to shoot myself or anybody else afterwards. Further, I wasn't at all confused about what was going on, and not once did I notice something in the timing scroll that made me ask myself "how in hell did that happen?"
We were watching the same race? Tell me please, how 'dinger ended up in P2 then. I don't recall him passing on track and don't recall hearing how he passed anybody in the pits... :confused:
Opposite Lock
07-25-04, 09:53 PM
In the race I watched, 'Dinger ended up in P3. :)
fourrunner
07-25-04, 10:11 PM
I like how Rick Benjamin puts is utterances in the form of a question to Tommy Kendal instead of just saying stuff he isn't sure about... first it lets Tommy shine with his descriptive and informative answers, and as things settle down the questions take the form of "straight lines" for Tommy's hilarious one liners.
The Race was Stunningly Beautiful on HDNET and Bronte in Modeling Mode was a great diversion ( I looked for warts and skin lesions in High Def format, but alas she is Perfect )
The "Lack" of Yellow flags did not help with the "Filler Pieces" so they had to squeeze them in somehow.
Before the Race they gave a list of how HIGH the attrition rate is in Vancouver ... However this year I believe there were only 4 DNF's which blew the previous statistics out of the water for the good!
I don't think there is such a thing as the "Perfect Broadcast"
I look at this year as a "Gift" ... I will never complain when someone gives me a Gift! :)
Well, Global covered it in Canada. They started at 3:30 PM EDT and ended at 6:15 Pm EDT. Chris McClure was part of the team. Overall they did a very good job. A couple of times the picture was someone from Spike doing an interview but we got no sound - they were totally separate telecasts. I was very pleased with the show.
I took a look in at the Lemming race at the end and it just happened to be when Paul Page said that Andretti and Newman Haas were dominating the IRL this year. Very funny.
On following PT, and missing some of the other storylines, remember that they were using the feed provided to them by GlobalTV, or whoever the host broadcaster was. In Canada, it has pretty much always been "All Canadians, All the Time."
In Toronto they did the same thing. Except there, PT was the real story of the race.
On following PT, and missing some of the other storylines, remember that they were using the feed provided to them by GlobalTV, or whoever the host broadcaster was. In Canada, it has pretty much always been "All Canadians, All the Time."
In Toronto they did the same thing. Except there, PT was the real story of the race.
I sure didn't see them spending an unrealistic amount of time on PT on Global. I think Spike gets the feed from all the cameras and does its own production.
Lizzerd
07-25-04, 11:08 PM
In the race I watched, 'Dinger ended up in P3. :)
Duh... What I meant was how did he make his way to P2 (by mid-race) from P11. Didn't hear anybody getting excited or explaining from the booth how he did that. Should have been a hot topic.
Methanolandbrats
07-25-04, 11:31 PM
They have to get off Spike. Nuthing on Spike but whores, Japs dressed in velcro and rasslin'. There is no way to take a race seriously when that crap interrupts every few minutes.
Ed_Severson
07-25-04, 11:39 PM
We were watching the same race? Tell me please, how 'dinger ended up in P2 then.
No problem.
Allmendinger and Jourdain were 2 of the last 3 guys to pit at the end of the first stint (the other being Dominguez, who came out behind Tagliani, Junqueira and Bourdais and got stuck in 7th for quite a while). They both managed to beat the Newman-Haas guys out of the pits with good pit work and good strategy.
They mentioned it right after the two of them came out of the pits, and even asked Jeremy Dale how they managed it on the air during the broadcast.
Maybe next time, you should watch harder. ;)
4wheeldrifter
07-26-04, 07:29 AM
We were watching the same race? Tell me please, how 'dinger ended up in P2 then. I don't recall him passing on track and don't recall hearing how he passed anybody in the pits... :confused:
I noticed that too. Guys in the booth were even cornfused about it, saying "Bourdais just passed (whoever), no wait, he's behind them now" (paraphrase, obviously). Shades of ABC on that one. Don't show the little passing that there was.
For some folks, life sucks and then you die. Many of them seem to congregate in Internet bulletin boards.
The coverage was fine. The fact that it exists at all is a miracle. Lighten up.
jonovision_man
07-26-04, 09:06 AM
For some folks, life sucks and then you die. Many of them seem to congregate in Internet bulletin boards.
:) :laugh:
Dirty Sanchez
07-26-04, 09:14 AM
I thought it was bush league. Tired of listening to Kendall fellate PT all broadcast long also.
There are only two better ways to watch the race -- use Race Director or buy a ticket.
There is also HDNet.
No commercials. In fact this time they had TK and Rick Benjamin talking during the Spike commercial breaks.
I didn't notice any of the Bronte pieces during the race. (might have missed one when I went outside for a smoke)
A few times when they did pit interviews or tech pieces the did it via PIP or mulitple windows so the race was still showing. Did Spike do that?
I enjoyed it! :thumbup:
Spicoli
07-26-04, 09:37 AM
HDNet is the only way to watch. I've only seen 1 race on Spike. F__k Spike.
Oh yeah. Being there is even cooler. ;)
Fitti Fan
07-26-04, 10:35 AM
I thought it was bush league. Tired of listening to Kendall fellate PT all broadcast long also.
Ditto. It's getting rather tiresome.
I watched it on RD...it was awesome as usual as I plug it into the TV, no commercials full of racing on all 6 cameras. NICE!
Steve99
07-26-04, 01:37 PM
No problem.
Allmendinger and Jourdain were 2 of the last 3 guys to pit at the end of the first stint (the other being Dominguez, who came out behind Tagliani, Junqueira and Bourdais and got stuck in 7th for quite a while). They both managed to beat the Newman-Haas guys out of the pits with good pit work and good strategy.
They mentioned it right after the two of them came out of the pits, and even asked Jeremy Dale how they managed it on the air during the broadcast.
Maybe next time, you should watch harder. ;)
Jeremy Dale said they did it by short filling. What I don't understand is why that didn't catch up with them on the second stop. They definately could have covered that situation better.
cheesewhiz
07-26-04, 01:42 PM
They're actually called motors in some parts of the world ;)
The way it was explained to me is that a "motor" is electric whereas an engine
is internal combustion.
Bottom line though..............WGAF! :gomer:
racer2c
07-26-04, 01:58 PM
I prefer "engine" over "motor". My old school shop teacher would throw a hissy if anyone called an engine a motor. It was discussed in a thread here or back on 7G and someone posted a definition that actually shows that both are correct and that a motor is not necessarily run via electricity.
Andrew Longman
07-26-04, 02:22 PM
I looked forward to the race all day and enjoyed the race.
The fact that I was not distracted by the broadcast and focused on the race tells me they did a good job. I think they are actually finding their groove.
The fact that it is on at all makes me happy.
The fact that it can also be watched on HDNet and RD (just not by me...yet) is awesome. No other series has that. It shows the savvy and direction CCWS is headed.
I could live without the promos for other Spike stuff, though I find it far less offensive and family friendly than promos on Fox during NFL games (how a cable channel for men can be less offensive that over-the-air network amazes me. I'll take tounge in cheek Joe Schmo over endless in my face Cops and Bachelor promos)
And I don't mind TK tooting PT. I know its authentic and PT is often deserving. And I know he doesn't really care if we don't like it. Now if he was getting breathless about Sperifico like he was the second coming of Sarah Fisher (as some networks have been known to do) that would be different.(and no comments about Sarah's second coming. ;) )
devilmaster
07-26-04, 02:57 PM
(and no comments about Sarah's second coming. ;) )
ARSEHOLE!!!!
Must......wash.......brain.......
;)
Steve
JohnHKart
07-26-04, 05:57 PM
I know I've heard and seen this argument before.
Motor is an electrical device whereas an Engine is gas or diesel powered. Here's some genius explaining it:
Date: Tue Mar 23 15:37:09 1999
Posted By: Frederick Carranti, Staff, Mechanical, Aerospace, & Manufacturing Engineering, Syracuse University
Area of science: Engineering
ID: 920936769.Eg
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message:
The basic difference is this:
A motor (or, more formally, an electric motor) is a device which converts
electrical energy into mechanical energy. They come in all variety of size
and type. It is rather easy to build a simple one, and I am sure that any
good science store would have kits to do that, or books to guide you
through a home project.
An engine (or, more formally, a heat engine) is a device that converts
chemical energy or heat energy into mechanical energy. The three main
types are the internal combustion piston engine (like the engine in your
automobile, gas turbine engines (like the powerplants used in jet
aircraft), and steam engines. There are kits available for steam engines
(check out Edmund Scientific), and there are plastic models to display the
components of automotive engines. again found in most good science
stores).
Hope this helps.
Frederick J. Carranti, P.E.
pkvracing12
07-26-04, 06:06 PM
I'm not to big on this crap. Spike needs to make it so its less a reality tv show and show what we want. I want every race live and not slashed due to 2 hour time limit becuase spike wants to show a James Bond marathon or what ever. Im becoming very dissapointed. I want Speed Channel again. The only thing I like is that got rid of that redneck sports brodcaster Bob jenkins.
I hope after this season spike will become a thing of the past. :flame:
Andrew Longman
07-26-04, 06:25 PM
I'm not to big on this crap. Spike needs to make it so its less a reality tv show and show what we want. I want every race live and not slashed due to 2 hour time limit becuase spike wants to show a James Bond marathon or what ever. Im becoming very dissapointed. I want Speed Channel again. The only thing I like is that got rid of that redneck sports brodcaster Bob jenkins.
I hope after this season spike will become a thing of the past. :flame:
Would I like/did I prefer Speed? You bet.
Would I like it to move back to Speed? Selfishly yes. I watch precisely nothing else on Spike. Speed did a good job with Champcar and Champcar on Speed would likely mean they would have to give up something of their wall-to-wall NASCAR coverage (NBS24/7? Someone wants to know THAT much about a ladder series? Please. And how many NASCAR talkshows are needed? Trackside, Inside NC, This Week in NC, etc)
But this is what we have and I'm glad to have it. It is also doing more to brand CCWS than Speed ever could and form a unique identity going forward. Spike is a CBS property. Let CCWS incubate on Spike. Let the 3 amigos get a complete schedule together of exciting races and events. Let them get the equipment and teams sorted out to improve the on track product. Let the HDNet and RD show the industry how to showcase this type of entertainment product, and we can all hope to see coverage going big time with lots of different options tailored to your preferences and interests.
That includes the on track experience. e.g., Kangaroo is a cool way to personalize and up scale your track experience.
BTW, it was only a little more than 10 years ago that NASCAR races were largely only on cable channels ESPN, TNT and TNN (now Spike). Cable was in a fraction of the homes today. It didn't take too long to outgrow those incubators.
Hard Driver
07-26-04, 09:50 PM
I wish there was more racing too. I would not be as harsh as some. But like ANY sport, the people are watching to see the game. You don't miss plays in the NFL to do articles on models and so forth.
Don't blame Spike for anything having to do with the production (or promotion), that is done entirely by Beetlejuice.
Methanolandbrats
07-26-04, 10:17 PM
I thought it was bush league. Tired of listening to Kendall fellate PT all broadcast long also.
:D
I looked forward to the race all day and enjoyed the race.
)
That's your probelm right there. But hang out here long enough and you will be cured. You will learn that everything sucks. No passing sucks. Too many shunts sucks. TV coverage sucks. PT sucks.
That's your probelm right there. But hang out here long enough and you will be cured. You will learn that everything sucks. No passing sucks. Too many shunts sucks. TV coverage sucks. PT sucks.
Too true. How many folks, when faced with the opportunity to show at the Lottery office to pick up their winnings of, say, MILLIONS, retort...............
Ya mean I have to miss tonights repeat of Friends??????
Or shower and dress myself????????
And a trip to see that evil bank manager that foreclosed on my trailer last year???
An NOW I suppose that all my deadbeat relatives will come outta the woodwork!
This is TOO much trouble!!!!! :cry: :cry: :cry:
Spicoli
07-27-04, 08:30 AM
I thought it was bush league. Tired of listening to Kendall fellate PT all broadcast long also.
HATER.
I know I've heard and seen this argument before.
Motor is an electrical device whereas an Engine is gas or diesel powered. Here's some genius explaining it:
Date: Tue Mar 23 15:37:09 1999
Posted By: Frederick Carranti, Staff, Mechanical, Aerospace, & Manufacturing Engineering, Syracuse University
Area of science: Engineering
ID: 920936769.Eg
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Message:
The basic difference is this:
A motor (or, more formally, an electric motor) is a device which converts
electrical energy into mechanical energy. They come in all variety of size
and type. It is rather easy to build a simple one, and I am sure that any
good science store would have kits to do that, or books to guide you
through a home project.
An engine (or, more formally, a heat engine) is a device that converts
chemical energy or heat energy into mechanical energy. The three main
types are the internal combustion piston engine (like the engine in your
automobile, gas turbine engines (like the powerplants used in jet
aircraft), and steam engines. There are kits available for steam engines
(check out Edmund Scientific), and there are plastic models to display the
components of automotive engines. again found in most good science
stores).
Hope this helps.
Frederick J. Carranti, P.E.
Let's end all this and just call it a lump. Works for me.
Formula 409
07-27-04, 09:56 AM
About the race coverage - the mistake they're making is placing the "lifestyle" stuff as a top priority to get into the race broadcast. Unless I misunderstand what I've seen of the ratings, Dangerous Curves - The Champ Car Lifestyle Show - is getting equal or better ratings than the races. So why repeat the same features in the race itself? Everyone saw them just a couple of hours ago.
When one of these clips come on, all I am doing is shouting at my TV set to get back to the race. It really ticks me off, and I don't think I'm alone in this. If putting lifestyle segments into the race is so important, pony up for more time to do a pre-race. That's what every other sport does. When AJ Allmendinger or Miss Indy comes on the show and gets in the way of watching the race, I'm angry to see them there. That is the exact opposite effect of what you want from those segments. So stop it!
We have half a season left with the series, so focus on making the TV broadcast the best TV broadcast it can possibly be. Keep it simple. Keep it focused on the race. If you concentrate on finding the best camera angles, documenting every fight for position and get every last bit of strategy into the broadcast, this is what makes a compelling TV race. Get rid of all the other stuff distracting you. When you have distilled the mission of the TV show down to making it the best pure racing broadcast on TV, you will attract the viewers we need. Any story, when told well, will keep someone's attention and hold them.
Railbird
07-27-04, 12:45 PM
IMO some folks around here are expecting way too much from an organization which is just a few months old and is pretty much learning how to walk while at a dead run. Nothing is going to bring back the late nineties level of professionalism at this point in time.
I watched the HDnet broadcast in a bar with the usual suspects, not the best enviroment to capture the finer points of the commentary, and have since watched the Spike coverage twice, once in Kellner mode with headphones and complete concentration and another time as I surfed.
The commercial-free aspect of the HD broadcast is fantastic but a little unrealistic to expect for the general viewing future. Plus they still interject those annoying sidebars during green flag racing. While I found the "Where's Memo" segment entertaining I think racefans would be better served if this kind of fluff was viewed pre/post race or at least during FCYs.
I found the Spike broadcast to be a whole lot better than some here are giving them credit for. Sure there are a lot of commercials, that's what makes it possible to see it at all, but if you go back to the Long Beach telecast even the most cynical would have to admit it is getting better. Spike itself is somewhat off the wall but it does offer exposure to a large audience and is owned by one of the major networks so there is definate growth possibilities.
Pfc m Drake said it best when he suggested that the need is for an injection of rsce savy into the beetlejuice organization, but I do believe they are learning.
Patience racefans, the three amigos have talked about plans in a three to five year time frame, I would think we could at least give them their first full season before condeming their efforts.
Be glad there is a TV deal and be particularly glad there is a series at all.
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