Watkins Glen work in progress

[Brickman]

http://www.nascar.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2004/08/15/glen_sunday/10.jpg

http://www.the-leader.com/content/articles/2005/01/14/sports/sports01.jpg

http://www.the-leader.com/articles/2005/01/14/sports/sports01.txt

[Winston Wolfe]

you gotta love the .1RL spin doctors who assisted in the development of this creative writing peice!

Quote:
"We are committed to the continued success of Watkins Glen International, the Home of American Road Racing, and are getting ready for one of the best seasons in over 20 years," said WGI president Craig Rust.
End.

The "Home of American Road Racing"?????

Did Enge give this guy some of his personal stash to sample before he spoke ?

Earl spin is everywhere.

Nice to see they are moving back to armco "open wheel can openers", and putting tires near the wooded areas, and paving over some of the runoff areas. Now all they need is a control tower to monitor take offs and they are all set.

This stuff is disturbing. :shakehead

Dashley wouldnt drive at Laguna a few years ago, but he'll go to this place.

[Jervis Tetch 1]

As much as I dislike them (Dashley, Sham, Snott Sharp), I don't want them to end up like Francois Cevert nor Helmuth Koinigg and I fear that could happen even with all these "upgrades."

[fourrunner]

I believe those Bulldozers are for pushing the Crapwagons off the circuit ... One at each corner ! Warmed up & ready to go!

I Believe the plan is to have Large Dumpsters at each corner also to dispose of the cars ... It's up to the Driver if he or she wants to get out ! ;)

[Rocketdoc]

"...end up like Francois Cevert nor Helmuth Koinigg...."

It hurts me to say that I was there at both events and within 100 feet of each accident (far too close to Francois), and I feel that this is just a "make shift" way of the France's, Penske and the Cokehead of trying to ram their "sham version" (IRL ) of road racing up the paying customers heiny.

They are all, the worst of American racing.

[Brickman]

The end justifies the means for the needed safety improvements. I won't be going to any race there this year. It will be interesting to see the scope of safety improvements.

[pineapple]

The end justifies the means for the needed safety improvements.

But, the end is nothing more than the same old track with the same old can opener armco.


The signature powder-blue guardrail has been moved away from the racing surface by an additional 20 feet in sectors of the track, contrary to published reports which had the total removal of the Armco barriers.

Meanwhile new, reinforced tire barriers have been added at the high-impact areas, wooded areas of the course have been cleared for better driver visibility in the low-slung, open-wheeled machines and new runoff zones have been added. Some patches of runoff will be paved altogether.

In addition to the above, fencing in key areas of the course will be added to or installed - most notably through the Esses - and track workers have removed the wooden bleachers along the front straightaway. Foundations are being laid to anchor the 42-row aluminum grandstands, which will be installed before the auto racing season begins at the course in June.

I'm sure the Grand-am guys will appreciate the additional tires.

[Methanolandbrats]

Home of American Road Racing? I'm gonna puke. The sooner every ******* associated with the IRL dies and begins rotting in hell the better. I am so sick of this ****.

[racer2c]

Home of American Road Racing? I'm gonna puke. The sooner every ******* associated with the IRL dies and begins rotting in hell the better. I am so sick of this ****.

Wasn't that quote from the WG president? They've made that claim just for having tintops lope around. Sad. :shakehead

[Methanolandbrats]

Wasn't that quote from the WG president? They've made that claim just for having tintops lope around. Sad. :shakehead My mistake if it was the WG President, but **** him too :D

[Opposite Lock]

"...end up like Francois Cevert nor Helmuth Koinigg...."

It hurts me to say that I was there at both events and within 100 feet of each accident (far too close to Francois), and I feel that this is just a "make shift" way of the France's, Penske and the Cokehead of trying to ram their "sham version" (IRL ) of road racing up the paying customers heiny.

They are all, the worst of American racing.

Wow. Welcome, Rocketdoc.

[Methanolandbrats]

[Steve99]

http://www.the-leader.com/content/articles/2005/01/14/sports/sports01.jpg


The crapwagons in this pic seem to be looking better this year. Not nearly as ugly as last year. Although they seem to be off track a bit.

[extramundane]

Maybe they'll get rid of those pesky elevation changes and right-hand turns too. Y'know, in the name of safety.

[Spicoli]

the new wing package is about as big as the blade on that "digger".

:gomer:

no matter what Version they're on, it still sucks wang. in fact, it gets worser every year.

[Hot Rod Otis]

If I'm not mistaken, "The Home of American Road Racing" was one of Watkins Glen's slogans long before before the Grandson started the irl.

[Napoleon]

There is no way they are going to make the improvements that are needed. It would cost way too much.

[DjDrOmusic]

It was a sad day when NASCRAP showed it's head at the Glen, it is now a sign of the apocalypse with FTG trying to replace real race cars at this circuit. I was right in front of Francois Cevert when he met his untimely end, and was in view of Helmuth Konig's accident. If the armco doesn't go away, I fear for, not only the true road racers that will climb into a TG autographed professional spine wrecker, but the drivers like AJ4 who have no clue how to race on a real track. :shakehead :(

[Jervis Tetch 1]

It was a sad day when NASCRAP showed it's head at the Glen, it is now a sign of the apocalypse with FTG trying to replace real race cars at this circuit. I was right in front of Francois Cevert when he met his untimely end, and was in view of Helmuth Konig's accident. If the armco doesn't go away, I fear for, not only the true road racers that will climb into a TG autographed professional spine wrecker, but the drivers like AJ4 who have no clue how to race on a real track. :shakehead :(My sentiments exactly and I do hope to Heaven this does NOT happen.

Take that you effing Crack Forum smokers. NONE of us at Off Camber wants to see your boys get hurt or killed.

[Accipiter]

No Armco is good Armco. These changes are insufficient.
:thumdown:

[Brickman]

http://www.nascar.com/multimedia/photo_gallery/2004/08/15/glen_sunday/10.jpg

http://www.the-leader.com/content/articles/2005/01/14/sports/sports01.jpg

http://www.the-leader.com/articles/2005/01/14/sports/sports01.txt


http://www.indycar.com/multimedia/build_photo.php?photo_id=18797&size=med

From the race over the weekend I could see numerous changes, they paved the exit out of the boot, shaved down the curbs, paved turn one run off area. With so few TV cameras couldn't really see all the changes. Have to wait until Cup arrives in August. I think they still need to change the angle of the inside turn on guardrail.

Wheldon's comments.

"I think it's challenging," said Wheldon, who has won four of the six races this season. "The corner after the chicane, let me tell you, if (Formula One star Michael) Schumacher was here, there's no way he'd set foot on this track on that corner. He'd want to miss that. The barrier is way too close. If Schumacher saw that barrier right there, he'd freak out."

[racer2c]

From the race over the weekend I could see numerous changes, they paved the exit out of the boot, shaved down the curbs, paved turn one run off area. With so few TV cameras couldn't really see all the changes. Have to wait until Cup arrives in August. I think they still need to change the angle of the inside turn on guardrail.

Wheldon's comments.

"I think it's challenging," said Wheldon, who has won four of the six races this season. "The corner after the chicane, let me tell you, if (Formula One star Michael) Schumacher was here, there's no way he'd set foot on this track on that corner. He'd want to miss that. The barrier is way too close. If Schumacher saw that barrier right there, he'd freak out."

We allready knew Shuey was smarter than you Dan, but thanks for the confirmation. :)

[RichK]

Wheldon and Schumacher in the same sentence is just wrong.

[Winston Wolfe]

ARMCO = Can Opener :rolleyes:

Wheldon's comments are not encouraging.

[trauma1]

this is setting up to be a disaster, could be real ugly, just WTF are they thinking setting the course up like this. :shakehead

[Brickman]

ARMCO = Can Opener :rolleyes:

Wheldon's comments are not encouraging.

That's where JD Mc Duffie lost his life. I believe they now have a tire wall wrapped in rubber. But like I said, have to wait until August until I can see if they made changes.

Monaco is nothing but Armco.

http://www.travelplaces.co.uk/images/renault_pages/monaco-gp-race-picture.jpg

[Ziggy]

Monaco is nothing but Armco.

Ah, setting up the Kool Aid stand early I see Brickey.

Monaco is void of Scot Sharp as well. Does Monaco have a wheel fence? IF your going to Watkins Glen, take your butterfly net

[Andrew Longman]

FWIW WG replaced all their fencing 1-2 years ago. It's seriously upgraded to what you would see at most oval tracks.

No guarantee that they will contain a flying wheel but far better than what it was

[pchall]

Monaco is nothing but Armco.

[


Average speeds on a lap at Monaco are a bit slower. ;)

Would F1 or Champcar even consider racing at a track with Armco that close to the racing line at the speeds a modern car can run? There is a reason that tracks with "safety" like that were left behind. Just ask Francois Cevert and Helmut Koenig.

BTW, I am appalled that the revised Armco apparently still has visible gaps between the layers and is still so close to the racing surface.

[Chief]

Rust never sleeps Brickman and that Armco has been there since like the 1960's too. Monaco is tightly bound and new....WGI is a smorgasboard of death metal. Rationalize away....

Turn 2 (bottom of esses) has NO runoff and is where the old chicane was. Very dangerous, very very dangerous. But, what the heck, when it's done they'll be pros at extracting flying objects from Armco. Just another day in the i.R>L>

[JT265]

Monaco is nothing but Armco.

Ah, setting up the Kool Aid stand early I see Brickey.

Monaco is void of Scot Sharp as well. Does Monaco have a wheel fence? IF your going to Watkins Glen, take your butterfly net


:rofl:

[Opposite Lock]

I've been spending this week at the old family homestead, about an hour west of WGI. Having never been to WGI, (I moved away before I became a racing fan), we decided to finally check out the track this past Sunday, which happened to be the 6 hour Grand-Am race.

Off topic, the GA race wasn't nearly as bad as our ALMS-only friends here would have us believe, and in fact I enjoyed what I saw of it. The Corvettes sounded great, the BMWs kind of quiet, the Porsches surprisingly shrill, not like I remember the SuperCup Porsches sounding at the USGP. The DPs were, well, not too easy on the eyes, but fast and most had an ok song. We left before the heavy rains came, but I was really only there to see the track, so go ahead and call me a fair weather fan. (It was really a time thing, not a weather thing.) Actually, unlike CC v. IRL, when it comes to the great ALMS v. Grand-Am debates, I don't feel any compelling reason to NOT be a fence-sitter - the "just more racing" position works for me, but I admit to not understanding all the political nuances behind the scenes. And while standing right behind the Ganasty pit, I had the perfect opportunity to "salute" Fat Chip up close. :cool:

Back on topic, although we didn't have time to explore the south half of the track, from what I could see around the Esses, the front straight and pits , and turns 10 and 11, the only things that looked new to me were the aforementioned paved runoff at turn 1, and the front straight grandstands (still under construction). Didn't see the famous giant chunks of styrofoam, but I think those are further south. All the Armco I saw looked ancient. Saw a couple cars get beached between turns 10 and 11. Overall facilities looked pretty bushleague compared to say RA. Beautiful countryside, though, but still pretty rural. Was surprised to discover that one of the infield roads is named after my tiny hometown of Canisteo.

Slightly off topic again, Danicle-mania is still in full force in all the regional newspapers 'round here. The IRL had open testing at WGI yesterday, (Wednesday), and she made front page headlines on at least the Corning paper. There is one scribe from this rag, whom I've been ragging on for a couple years, who also likes to cite regional crackpot Brock Yates as a relevant voice in the racing world. We didn't bother going back for the IRL testing, but if various local sportscasters are to be believed, it sounds like they had a bigger crowd for the "Danicle and Company" event than I saw at the GA 6 hours race.

[cart7]

but if various local sportscasters are to be believed, it sounds like they had a bigger crowd for the "Danicle and Company" event than I saw at the GA 6 hours race.

......Ahh forget it.... don't wanna incite SeanO. ;) :laugh:

[Sean O'Gorman]

Everything I have to say about Grand-Am I'm pretty sure I've said by now, you don't have to worry about me spouting off much.

[Rogue Leader]

Monaco does not have any where near the high speed corners that WG does, nor does it have all the breaks in the Armco that even the improved WG does.

I pray noone meets it.... :(

[TKGAngel]

Slightly off topic again, Danicle-mania is still in full force in all the regional newspapers 'round here. The IRL had open testing at WGI yesterday, (Wednesday), and she made front page headlines on at least the Corning paper. There is one scribe from this rag, whom I've been ragging on for a couple years, who also likes to cite regional crackpot Brock Yates as a relevant voice in the racing world. We didn't bother going back for the IRL testing, but if various local sportscasters are to be believed, it sounds like they had a bigger crowd for the "Danicle and Company" event than I saw at the GA 6 hours race.

She was on the front page of the Buffalo paper, and the lead story on at least 2 stations 6pm and 11pm newscasts. I heard her say she's happy to be doing her part to bring attention to the IRL, since any press for open-wheel racing is better than none, but there's how many other drivers out there that the media should be focusing on.

Off topic: she's the cover story in this month's Racer (which includes a story about fear in driving and shows a pic of Zanardi sitting in the car post-accident), and the motor-racing section in SI is all Danica all the time. When did averageness become newsworthy?

[Winston Wolfe]

[QUOTE=Brickman]That's where JD Mc Duffie lost his life. I believe they now have a tire wall wrapped in rubber. But like I said, have to wait until August until I can see if they made changes.

Monaco is nothing but Armco.


Typical cynic, brick :rolleyes:

so we have to wait until august until you can see the changes ? Why, so you can make another asanine post with your fence sitting perspective ?
Save it.

I stand by my comments and your reference to Monaco is irrelevant. Speeds are dramatically different at the two tracks, and will be for this race. Why dont you use your wealth of knowledge and ability to locate facts which suit your needs and post the average lap speed and time for the last F1 at Watkins Glen as well as Monaco during the last year they raced there in the same year ?

The speeds that even the EARL sleds will generate here, combined with the pack racing mentality they have in the .1rl will give this race a higher potenital pucker factor than Monaco.
Armco is much older at WGI, and look at some of the potential impact angles on some parts of the track at WGI. You seem to have a good memory when it suits you....

Armco = can opener :thumdown:

Like I said previously, Dashley refused to drive at LS back in the CART days, and now appears ready to drive at the Glen.... MAN, he must be drinking the Kool-AId concentrate RIGHT OUT OF THE CAN !!!!!

[Methanolandbrats]

People can question the intelligence of risking being sawed in half by a guard rail, they can laugh at Danicle, but if Wonder Girl and the Earl Pilots draw a good crowd, who do you think FTG will be on the phone with monday morning. Which tracks do you think he will rent???? Assuming he lands those while Champcar is driving around San Jose and China, which series will sponsors look at as a good investment...........................

[nrc]

Monaco is nothing but Armco.Are you saying that Watkins Glenn is just as safe as Monaco for open wheel competition?

[racer2c]

People can question the intelligence of risking being sawed in half by a guard rail, they can laugh at Danicle, but if Wonder Girl and the Earl Pilots draw a good crowd, who do you think FTG will be on the phone with monday morning. Which tracks do you think he will rent???? Assuming he lands those while Champcar is driving around San Jose and China, which series will sponsors look at as a good investment...........................

Which US based companies are climbing over themselves to get to China?

[Methanolandbrats]

Which US based companies are climbing over themselves to get to China? Only WalMart, that's my point. I think Champcar is screwed, I'm about ready to throw in the towel. Call me a Gomer, call it doom and gloom, call it anything you want, but after Milwaukee I'm having a hard time being optomistic.

[dando]

Only WalMart, that's my point. I think Champcar is screwed, I'm about ready to throw in the towel. Call me a Gomer, call it doom and gloom, call it anything you want, but after Milwaukee I'm having a hard time being optomistic.
Really? Seems to me that MSFT was recently in the news about issues with censorship in China. What about auto mfgs trying to get a foothold in China? Telecoms? The list of US companies (and states) trying to establish business ties w/China is quite long, actually.

-Kevin

[Sean O'Gorman]

Go look at the computer industry in China and how American companies are rushing to get there.

I wont argue that China isn't a lucrative market for business but its not going to put any more unsubsidized sponsors on the sidepods of our race cars.

[RusH]

I`m hoping the billion Chinese who go to the race can pay for us to have our toys back. Elkhart, Laguna, Mid-Ohio. It wouldn`t matter how many showed up then. :gomer:
I`ll celebrate with an order of pork fried rice, egg roll, and Tsing Tao.
Anything less?, :shakehead




I can`t go to races too far away because of my job, you know.
My boss, Mr.Spacely wants me to work on putting Cogswell Cogs out of business, then there if the wife..Jane, that biatch. And Astro hates kennels.

[Methanolandbrats]

Really? Seems to me that MSFT was recently in the news about issues with censorship in China. What about auto mfgs trying to get a foothold in China? Telecoms? The list of US companies (and states) trying to establish business ties w/China is quite long, actually.

-Kevin I Know all that ******** about China. THey have no debt and a huge trade surplus. They're gonna kick our ass and become a World Power. Who GAF. Champcar is abandoning NA and trying to turn into F1 while FTG is slowly becoming the NA open wheel series. This is where KK and all are
self flagellating.

[Brickman]

[QUOTE=Brickman]That's where JD Mc Duffie lost his life. I believe they now have a tire wall wrapped in rubber. But like I said, have to wait until August until I can see if they made changes.

Monaco is nothing but Armco.


Typical cynic, brick :rolleyes:

so we have to wait until august until you can see the changes ? Why, so you can make another asanine post with your fence sitting perspective ?
Save it.

I'm not fence sitting Watkins Glen is a great track, I think and have thought open wheel can be done there. I would prefer blue painted concrete to armco, and I have said so in numerous posts. I was just commenting that I wasn't able to see from the GA race what changes have taken place in that section of the track. Did they add a sand trap? Stay with the rubber wrapped tires ala US GP? Did they put up blocks of Styrofoam (inaffective with open wheel IMO) The turn 5 area is fast and is why they put in the "inner loop". I personally think it wasn't deep enough. I also think they need to expand the run off area. I would hope they did.

I failed to mention above that they also added a run off area after turn 11. So at least they won't need styrofoam as shown here. http://www.glenphotos.com/nascar04/crash06.JPG







I stand by my comments and your reference to Monaco is irrelevant. Speeds are dramatically different at the two tracks, and will be for this race. Why dont you use your wealth of knowledge and ability to locate facts which suit your needs and post the average lap speed and time for the last F1 at Watkins Glen as well as Monaco during the last year they raced there in the same year ?

The speeds that even the EARL sleds will generate here, combined with the pack racing mentality they have in the .1rl will give this race a higher potenital pucker factor than Monaco.

Armco is much older at WGI, and look at some of the potential impact angles on some parts of the track at WGI. You seem to have a good memory when it suits you....

Armco = can opener :thumdown:

Like I said previously, Dashley refused to drive at LS back in the CART days, and now appears ready to drive at the Glen.... MAN, he must be drinking the Kool-AId concentrate RIGHT OUT OF THE CAN !!!!!

I mentioned "impact angles" I think they missed. Again I have been all over that track and willbe watching the Cup race to see with the increased camera angles what the GA race missed.

1980 U.S. Grand Prix.
1:33.291 Bruno Giacomelli - Alfa-Romeo

1997 Historic
1:38.573 Andrea Montermini Ferrari 333SP

2005 Indy Car Test
1:31.7200 Ryan Briscoe Panoz/Toyota


Monaco
1980 Fastest Lap: Carlos Reutemann 1:27.41
2004 Fastest Lap: Michael Schumacher 1:14.43


So they added run off areas at 1 and 11. They paved the exit of 9 and no doubt will add tires to that run off area. They added catch fencing in the boot and previously they installed catch fencing down the fron straight and in other areas.

So what "potential impact angles" did I miss?

[racer2c]

Go look at the computer industry in China and how American companies are rushing to get there.

I wont argue that China isn't a lucrative market for business but its not going to put any more unsubsidized sponsors on the sidepods of our race cars.

Not until they race there at least.

[racer2c]

I Know all that ******** about China. THey have no debt and a huge trade surplus. They're gonna kick our ass and become a World Power. Who GAF. Champcar is abandoning NA and trying to turn into F1 while FTG is slowly becoming the NA open wheel series. This is where KK and all are
self flagellating.

hey, I'm with ya m&B, don't get me wrong. It's a travesty that the CCWS isn't at RA, LS or even MO. I real travesty. What I'm holding out for though, is that money made off of places like China will allow them to buy their way back to at least one of those venues where they belong.

The IRL will soon be over it's Danickle fever and they are still in the same sinking ship of the last year. When they start going for the road courses though (real road courses, not WG or SP), KK and GF need to step up. They did to get LB, they need to listen to the fans and get the real road courses back. At the very least one of them, preferably RA.

[Sean O'Gorman]

Not until they race there at least.

How would one race weekend save a series? It isn't working for Indy and they have the legend of INDY!

[Brickman]

Are you saying that Watkins Glenn is just as safe as Monaco for open wheel competition?


I'm saying there are numerous tracks that have armco and I don't recall people getting in a tizzy.

Mid-Ohio 1998 (http://www.theautochannel.com/callahan/98cart/mo1/andret01.jpg)


Laguna Seca 1999 (http://www.theautochannel.com/callahan/99laguna/moore_greg01.jpg)


Sebring 2002 (http://www.endurancesportscar.com/2002sebring/mondaytest/msseb02montest18.jpg)


USGP 2004 (http://www.wizco.net/dan/USGP2k2/26.jpg)

I fully recognize the dangers of armco. You don't want cars to punch through or under it. I think it's sad that open wheel in the U.S. has only three natural road courses, you don't have to be a math genuis to know who runs where. Is racing at Watkins Glen worse than 24 degree banked quad ovals? :shakehead

One I won't even watch on TV, the other I will.

[FCYTravis]

Um... at Laguna Seca, that's a single piece of guardrail shielding the pit wall signaling area from the pit road.

Hardly a triple-layer decapitator located three feet from 180 mph racecars.

[Dr. Corkski]

I wont argue that China isn't a lucrative market for business but its not going to put any more unsubsidized sponsors on the sidepods of our race cars.Lemming. :gomer:

Just look at how all those mega-successful races in Mexico and Canada are flooding the Champ Car sidepods with all those Mexican and Canadian sponsors. :laugh: :shakehead

[Winston Wolfe]

I'm saying there are numerous tracks that have armco and I don't recall people getting in a tizzy.

Mid-Ohio 1998 (http://www.theautochannel.com/callahan/98cart/mo1/andret01.jpg)


Laguna Seca 1999 (http://www.theautochannel.com/callahan/99laguna/moore_greg01.jpg)


Sebring 2002 (http://www.endurancesportscar.com/2002sebring/mondaytest/msseb02montest18.jpg)


USGP 2004 (http://www.wizco.net/dan/USGP2k2/26.jpg)

.

Point FAILED. :thumdown:

Do not pass GO. Do not collect $200.

Maybe you can discuss the finer points and benefits of armco with your buddies over on TF ?

[trauma1]

Lemming. :gomer:

Just look at how all those mega-successful races in Mexico and Canada are flooding the Champ Car sidepods with all those Mexican and Canadian sponsors. :laugh: :shakehead

i'll be interested now that MV is with coyne if any canadian sponsors are stepping up, or if he had to bring his own cash, every one says that ccws needs canadian and mexican drivers but seems no sponsors have come out of the woods to sponsor anyone?

[Rus'L]

2005 Indy Car Test (includes inner loop)
1:31.7200 Ryan Briscoe Panoz/Toyota

Wrong!

The IRL is NOT using the Inner Loop. And, they did NOT use it for the test day (my friend took photos for motorsport.com and the press release even says the time was set with no Inner Loop).

[Sean O'Gorman]

I think you have to go back to 1989 to find armco that drivers could actually hit at Mid-Ohio. :rolleyes:

[Brickman]

Wrong!

The IRL is NOT using the Inner Loop. And, they did NOT use it for the test day (my friend took photos for motorsport.com and the press release even says the time was set with no Inner Loop).

You are correct, they didn't use it in 97' either. I edited both from my original post. Thanks.

[Brickman]

I think you have to go back to 1989 to find armco that drivers could actually hit at Mid-Ohio. :rolleyes:

Funny, I don't see anything between Michael's car and the armco and that picture was taken in 1998. But since I haven't ever been there I'll take your word for it.

[Sean O'Gorman]

Funny, I don't see anything between Michael's car and the armco and that picture was taken in 1998. But since I haven't ever been there I'll take your word for it.

That is on the inside of the carousel, where corner workers would be. The guardrail facing the picture would be impossible to hit, at any sort of speed. On the part of the armco that is not facing the picture, there would be a tire wall on the other side.

Ironically that picture is from the only Mid-Ohio CART race since 1988 that I missed. :(

[Brickman]

Point FAILED. :thumdown:

Do not pass GO. Do not collect $200.

Maybe you can discuss the finer points and benefits of armco with your buddies over on TF ?

What no go to jail? ;)

I actually don't recall anyone ever complaining on any racing forum about the armco at any track I listed or not listed. You can win a trip to Boardwalk if you can explain why? Even this weekend's race at USGP, the Hulman back straight cars reach 180 mph right next to it. Concerning Watkins Glen what "potential impact angles" did I miss?

What I said on the subject last July:


Like I said before... They added new fencing a few years ago and the front straight temporary seats that have been up since 1989 are being replaced (http://dbserver.iscmotorsports.com/TheGlen/index.cfm) with new stands. Replace the armco with blue concrete New Jersey (http://www.roadstothefuture.com/Jersey_Barrier.html) or other barriers. But in all reality I think a driver's opinion like Tommy Kendall would mean more than opinion of fans of the track or non fans of the IRL. I personally think turn 8 would be the trickiest to create a better runoff area. However IF the cars are dogs why even bother.

[Brickman]

That is on the inside of the carousel, where corner workers would be. The guardrail facing the picture would be impossible to hit, at any sort of speed. On the part of the armco that is not facing the picture, there would be a tire wall on the other side.

Ironically that picture is from the only Mid-Ohio CART race since 1988 that I missed. :(
Thanks Sean. :thumbup: I saw other pictures on the web with cars right next to the red guardrail, but thought it was only fair to show the newest, since changes could have been made.

[coolhand]

I Know all that ******** about China. THey have no debt and a huge trade surplus. They're gonna kick our ass and become a World Power.

I dont think so, India is already far ahead of them in publically traded corperations and investments. China is lagging in other stuff. Also China is more heavily dependent on foreign energy thatn India or the US and is fighting for a pipline to to the oil from the cacuses and Russia. But their neighbors dont like them too much.

but whatever we dont need to discuss it, but i feel China is a good place to have a race but i dont think it will save the series. especially when you sell out your traditional road racing base for for china that could ditch you at any moment.

[Rocketdoc]

"who also likes to cite regional crackpot Brock Yates as a relevant voice in the racing world."

I like you without knowing you.

[theunions]

I dont think so, India is already far ahead of them in publically traded corperations and investments.

Stewart (Jackie...not Poster Boy) had an interesting comment during today's USGP broadcast...in mentioning the presence of Karthikeyan, he noted India now has more "middle class" individuals than the entire U.S. population, and these people would now be following the young Indian driver (and thus F1 in general) in earnest.

This followed his statement that the average F1 race is internationally "bigger than the Super Bowl, and Americans just don't understand that." :D

[Methanolandbrats]

The Commies are just getting wound up, they will spank the Dots.

[racer2c]

How would one race weekend save a series? It isn't working for Indy and they have the legend of INDY!

Are you on crack? Who said China was the saving grace of Champ Car? You're the one who's trying to portray that scenerio.

[nissan gtp]

so here's turn 1... paved the old gravel trap with "high friction assfault":

http://img293.echo.cx/img293/1489/turn16gb.jpg

then up the hill from 2, the blue rail on the left has been pushed back

http://img293.echo.cx/img293/3126/upthehill7xn.jpg

here's a shot of the backstraight heading toward the inner loop. How 'bout that old-school armco, baby !

http://img293.echo.cx/img293/2463/backstraight2ag.jpg

[nissan gtp]

into the boot, the old tirewall right at trackside is gone, railing is pushed back, with lots and lots of catchfence

http://img293.echo.cx/img293/6321/boot13xi.jpg

and coming out of the boot, more paving on the run-off in the foreground.
Also note the catch-fence in the background (it's were the tunnel goes under the track):

http://img293.echo.cx/img293/9153/outoftheboot0ya.jpg

[oddlycalm]

I think Champcar is screwed, I'm about ready to throw in the towel. Call me a Gomer, call it doom and gloom, call it anything you want, but after Milwaukee I'm having a hard time being optomistic. Whoa... take a step back from the edge and a couple deep breaths. On forums it's easy over-examine every nuance to the point of the big picture getting completely out of focus. It ain't over till it's over. Formula Idiot has a demonstrated propensity for self-inflicted groin injuries with regularity and Champcar is only four races into it's second season. Like any politics, if you think about it too much it'll make you nuts.

oc

[Brickman]

Now that wasn't so bad was it?

[trauma1]

it sucked. ask helio about his hit,

[oddlycalm]

Now that wasn't so bad was it? When the best part of a race weekend is reading pressdog's blog on Monday making fun of the brain dead announcers I think you can figure it out for yourself. Gomers At The Glen is something I could have lived my entire life without seeing and been perfectly happy. ISC's renovation is pathetic compared to what we see from lesser countries around the world.

What's next, some rich hick buys the New York Philiharmonic relocates it to the Grand Ole Opry to back Billy Ray Cyrus....?

oc

[Brickman]

it sucked. ask helio about his hit,

I actually though he, the car, and the armco stood up pretty go at the fastest part of the track.





When the best part of a race weekend is reading pressdog's blog on Monday making fun of the brain dead announcers I think you can figure it out for yourself. Gomers At The Glen is something I could have lived my entire life without seeing and been perfectly happy. ISC's renovation is pathetic compared to what we see from lesser countries around the world.

What's next, some rich hick buys the New York Philiharmonic relocates it to the Grand Ole Opry to back Billy Ray Cyrus....?

oc

ISC hasn't doen a full renovation of the facilities, Jimmy Spencer wants NASCAR to leave because he thinks the garages aren't even good enough.

If all Pressdog could do was laugh at the announcers instead of the racing, I would say that's pretty good.

It was a nice to see Indy Cars there again, even if they were ugly ones. I'm not complaining.

[Winston Wolfe]

I actually though he, the car, and the armco stood up pretty go at the fastest part of the track.






ISC hasn't doen a full renovation of the facilities, Jimmy Spencer wants NASCAR to leave because he thinks the garages aren't even good enough.

If all Pressdog could do was laugh at the announcers instead of the racing, I would say that's pretty good.

It was a nice to see Indy Cars there again, even if they were ugly ones. I'm not complaining.

Does your rear end ever get tired from that fence that you're sitting on ?
:rolleyes:

[RTKar]

I actually though he, the car, and the armco stood up pretty go at the fastest part of the track.






ISC hasn't doen a full renovation of the facilities, Jimmy Spencer wants NASCAR to leave because he thinks the garages aren't even good enough.If all Pressdog could do was laugh at the announcers instead of the racing, I would say that's pretty good.

It was a nice to see Indy Cars there again, even if they were ugly ones. I'm not complaining.

Jimmy Spencer isn't good enough.... He should keep his trap shut....not that I care what nascar or the earl does.

[Ankf00]

earl fumes smell good :gomer:

[Rocketdoc]

"I was right in front of Francois Cevert when he met his untimely end, and was in view of Helmuth Konig's accident. "

Damn, those were some sad days.

My friend and race car fabricator Bill Smith, who was about twenty feet from me, was where Cevert's head stopped, and I was about eighty feet from the site when Konig went under the Armco at the right hander at the boot.

The Glen offered severe punishment for even minor errors.

[oddlycalm]

The Glen offered severe punishment for even minor errors. Indeed. While I have a lot of great memories to go with the sad ones, it was always a track that had to be respected.

The place deserves better than to have wealthy hicks own it with taxi cabs and the EARL racing there.

oc