Honda missing JV?

[Railbird]

pitpass (http://www.pitpass.com/fes_php/pitpass_news_item.php?fes_art_id=23418)

strange, maybe they're missing the teenage ballerina

[Dr. Corkski]

The word on the street is that pitpass.com has a bigger hard on for JV than Sir Frank does for Jungle Boy. They pointed to "sources" but didn't even have a single quote to back it up. Besides, pinniped already said that drivers don't actually have input into the designs. :gomer:

(I apologize in advance if this post brings him and his multiple "I'm leaving" threads back.)

[chop456]

Chassis feedback is tangible, but I'd be interested to know what exactly goes into "engine feedback".

"Uh, when I pushed the pedal down, it went fast, but not too fast, kind of medium fast. Then when I pushed it all the way down, it got really loud and went a lot faster, then it went BANG! and I pulled off the track".

What can't you learn about an engine looking at fuel delivery, torque curves, gear ratio, RPM, Kph, etc.?

I'm with Cork.

[FTG]

Besides, pinniped already said that drivers don't actually have input into the designs.

I had an engineer from a F1 team tell me that all the driver does is "schmooze sponsors and date supermodels." Which are important, but have nothing to do with developing the car. I'm working on the assumption that he'd know more about it than anyone here until someone here can prove otherwise.

[Andrew Longman]

FWIW JV did have a lot to say about how the car sucked and didn't even look like a race car. That's feedback isn't it? :)

[racer2c]

Chassis feedback is tangible, but I'd be interested to know what exactly goes into "engine feedback".

"Uh, when I pushed the pedal down, it went fast, but not too fast, kind of medium fast. Then when I pushed it all the way down, it got really loud and went a lot faster, then it went BANG! and I pulled off the track".

What can't you learn about an engine looking at fuel delivery, torque curves, gear ratio, RPM, Kph, etc.?

I'm with Cork.

You two boys have fun. Anyone who's ever driven a race car or flown an airplane knows there's a differnce between computer data and seat of the pants data. If not, they wouldn't bother asking the drivers at all. They would simply pull into the pits and hop right into their laps of luxery.

So I guess the almighty Shumy is the only driver who gives actual car feedback. :rolleyes:

[Ankf00]

as far as my stuff goes, the astronauts have to approve what we're giving them to use... they have to be comfortable using it, but we will only accomodate them if 1. it's minor and 2. there's no performance hit. otherwise we just write a set of instructions and tell them to practice it more in the big swimming pool.

I would figure in F1, performance trumps all, but your driver has to be comfortable in the environment he is in, or at least be best suited to cope with it, his performance drives everything else's... From my completely ignorant point of view on the subject, I would imagine the driver's feedback for development is very important in that the car's dynamics suit the driver's style well.

[FTG]

In F1 it is very rare that the driver ever tells the engineer anything that they don't know. Of course, they can make the set up looser or tighter to suit the driver preference and and if a driver is talented enough to allow the engineers to run a looser set up, that is worth several million dollars. If you can run a looser set up and come close to the numbers that the engineer knows the car is capable of lap after lap, it can be worth tens of millions of dollars.

But why do you think that young drivers are able to come in and dominate right away? It doesn't matter that they don't have a lot of experience with high horse powered cars. The engineers and computers take care of acceleration. It doesn't matter that they don't have a lot of experience with set up. The engineers and computers take care of set up. The driver just brakes, turns and schmoozes. Schmoozing sponsors, and raising millions for the computers and the engineers, is far more important than any set up info they provide.

[racer2c]

...

But why do you think that young drivers are able to come in and dominate right away? ....


uh, talent and a top team. :gomer:

[RacinM3]

I had an engineer from a F1 team tell me that all the driver does is "schmooze sponsors and date supermodels." Which are important, but have nothing to do with developing the car. I'm working on the assumption that he'd know more about it than anyone here until someone here can prove otherwise.

True story....now more than ever.

[Railbird]

Sounds like an engineering geek fest around here to me.

While I have no clue as to what my cut and paste actually represents, in my life I've hung with some pretty talented racers, both engineers and chief mechanic types, who would beg to differ with some of these plug and play attititudes toward drivers.

[racer2c]

Sounds like an engineering geek fest around here to me.

While I have no clue as to what my cut and paste actually represents, in my life I've hung with some pretty talented racers, both engineers and chief mechanic types, who would beg to differ with some of these plug and play attititudes toward drivers.

Thank you.

[Dr. Corkski]

Apparantly all teams build their car with lots of input from their drivers but the evil Ferrari empire, who somehow manages to build a car that only Michael Schumacher is capable of driving without any sort of input from him. Who knows.

But then you have to wonder how valuable that "input" actually was when it took 4 years to build an engine that only self-destructed every few races instead of one that self-destructed every practice session.

[RacinM3]

While I have no clue as to what my cut and paste actually represents, in my life I've hung with some pretty talented racers, both engineers and chief mechanic types, who would beg to differ with some of these plug and play attititudes toward drivers.

Also a true story. My agreement with FTG was limited to the scope of his quote, namely F1 only.

I think the driver role is as alive as ever in just about every other series.

[racer2c]

Also a true story. My agreement with FTG was limited to the scope of his quote, namely F1 only.

I think the driver role is as alive as ever in just about every other series.

yeah, I would agree with that.

[Dirty Sanchez]

Maybe Honda should hire him as a consultant after he gets waxed by Massa for 2 years. :laugh:

[Easy]

Chassis feedback is tangible, but I'd be interested to know what exactly goes into "engine feedback".

"Uh, when I pushed the pedal down, it went fast, but not too fast, kind of medium fast. Then when I pushed it all the way down, it got really loud and went a lot faster, then it went BANG! and I pulled off the track".

What can't you learn about an engine looking at fuel delivery, torque curves, gear ratio, RPM, Kph, etc.?

I'm with Cork.


I read something in either Autosport or F1 Racing a while back about Senna and Prost at McLaren. It mentioned that Senna was in good favor with Honda because of his attitude and his superior engine feedback. Engine feedback could include info on power delivery (smooth or abrupt), drivability in the power band and countless other things I wouldn't pretend to know about.

[FTG]

Also a true story. My agreement with FTG was limited to the scope of his quote, namely F1 only.

I think the driver role is as alive as ever in just about every other series.


Yep. If the budget is under $100 million per year or so, the driver becomes more important. And F1 wasn't always that way. Gilles was the only one who could slide his car through the corners like it was a snowmobile, no matter what the other engineers did.