American drivers

[nrc]

I've been pleased to hear CART fans pressing the American driver issue at the Portland town meeting on on Wind Tunnel. I think Pook hears the message, but it's important that it be repeated until CART starts to make significant progress. It's a shame that CART can spend up to 30 million putting cars on the grid and only muster two Americans in the process.

But here's the thing. I'm not interested in American drivers just for the sake of American drivers. I don't need a specific number or some kind of quota. For me, the important point on American drivers has always been that as the premiere American open wheel series, CART should have the top Americans who can be competitive in the series. I don't know for certain what that number is, but I believe it's more than 2.

The sad thing is that I think Pook is correct that American drivers often aren't as well prepared, but the death of Indy Lights has only made that problem worse. That's not something that can't be fixed overnight.

[FortyOneFord]

It's a shame Fogarty isn't in a car this year. A standout American Atlantic champ without a ride. :( The good news is we know Pook & co. are hearing our complaints about lack of American talent, but we have yet to see where that goes. Although, one could argue ASTJ is a byproduct of the need for Americans in CART.

I agree no Americans just for the sake of having them; but with the talent we have standing on the sidelines, it's apparent something is wrong.

[911]

If they can keep supporting its own ladder system, then we will have talented, American drivers in C^RT. There are many quick drivers in karts at the moment and the Stars of Tomorrow series is starting to get them some much needed exposure.

[mnkywrch]

Originally posted by FortyOneFord
It's a shame Fogarty isn't in a car this year. A standout American Atlantic champ without a ride. :( The good news is we know Pook & co. are hearing our complaints about lack of American talent, but we have yet to see where that goes. Although, one could argue ASTJ is a byproduct of the need for Americans in CART.


It's a shame when ANY Atlantics champ is on the sidelines.

The way Buddy Rice leveled the field when he won the title, I couldn't believe that he didn't get picked up by someone.

The problem is that a good number of the last few series champs have all come up through the European ladder series. So the owners are going to value guys with respectable F3000 experience over a guy with a FA title - because that's who they've seen done well.

And when you see how quickly Bourdais and Haberfeld were to the front in St. Pete, it's hard to fault them.

But when the occasional American does get their chance, if they don't do well (Townsend Bell), they get yanked and all the owners use that guy as their reason not to hire from FA or Lights.

(Forgetting, of course, how guys like Minassian had a good record in F3000...)

[ChrisB]

Get more SCCA Pro classes as part of CART weekends! CART needs to have as much interaction between themselves and the SCCA formula classes... THAT's where the American formula road-racers can be found!

Also, Atlantics needs to come up to 450hp. Maybe CART should clone F3000 specs for Atlantics... or even the old Indy Lights specs (how ironic would that be?).

[Napoleon]

Personally I Do not care if they have American drivers or not, although I understand why its good for the series. Quite frankly with karting and racing in general being much more popular in other countries I don't see the situation ever changing since not only does the population of Europe and the rest of the America's dwarf the US, but those populations participate in racing in higher percentages then a Americans. On top of that foriegn companies appear to be more willing to support the quality drivers coming up the ranks.

For those who do not believe this theory just look at baseball and basketball for perfect examples of my theory in action. In baseball Central and South American players are beginning to dominate. Why, well last year I was listening to a preseason Cleveland Indians game which was being held in Venez. and the announcers were marveling at how every corner had a sandlot diamond and it appeared that every kid (who likely does not have 100 channels of cable or video games) was out playing from dawn to dusk. I have heard about a dozen similar stroies over the years.

In basketball blacks make it to the pro's in greater percentage then whites. It just so happenes when I drive in predomently black neighberhoods I am significantly more likely to see kids out playing at the local playground. I have 2 or 3 basketball courts near my house, a primarily white neighberhood, and I don't recall ever seeing a pickup game. I think there is a connection.

[RTKar]

I think we're in a bit of a dip in the driver development process currently. It seems that Karting is slowly starting to grow, as it becomes more high profile and recognized, we'll see more Americans improve their racing skills and flourish in CART. The guys like Memo, Herta and Barron are the tip of the iceberg, the pioneers of the process that other countries have had established for much longer. This country's development path was tradionally the short ovals and I think it's going to take some time before the mindset changes to Karts as the true way to develop as a top tier racer.

[nrc]

Originally posted by mnkywrch
But when the occasional American does get their chance, if they don't do well (Townsend Bell), they get yanked and all the owners use that guy as their reason not to hire from FA or Lights.

The sad thing was that Bell did well as far as showing that he had the speed. Even as a rookie in a Reynard with no teammate he was imediately qualifying top 5 or top 10 and scoring points (when he could finish).

Yes, he was brash and he crashed too much. But when a Euro-talent shows up and is over-agressive we hear about how they would rather reign someone in than push them to get speed.

[911]

Originally posted by RTKar
I think we're in a bit of a dip in the driver development process currently. It seems that Karting is slowly starting to grow, as it becomes more high profile and recognized, we'll see more Americans improve their racing skills and flourish in CART. The guys like Memo, Herta and Barron are the tip of the iceberg, the pioneers of the process that other countries have had established for much longer. This country's development path was tradionally the short ovals and I think it's going to take some time before the mindset changes to Karts as the true way to develop as a top tier racer.

Actually, RTKar, karting is not growing slowly, it has been established here in the States from quite some time. The trouble is not many people are aware of its presence. The guys you mentioned - Memo, Herta & Barron - were all top karters in their time here in California (I think that's what you were referring to). In fact, Memo still competes in karting today and does an excellent job promoting the sport. He even holds a karting clinic in Hawaii in the offseason. I believe he now has his own shifterkart chassis through Trackmagic.

Regarding the difference in mindset I think you are absolutely correct, no doubt. Like you mentioned, the Euros all know that the first step to a successful road racing career begins w/ karting. We need to establish that same type of perspective here, and I think it's starting to happen (i.e. Stars' program) now that CART has defined its ladder system.

We have some very talented karters. It's nice to read about our guys going over to Europe to do some testing/racing and they end up being just as quick as the their champions (i.e. Wade Van Hooser & Jason Bowles in Italy last month). Then you have guys like Paul Edwards, Patrick Long & Phil Giebler who have proven their talent in Europe, and they all come from an extensive karting background here in SoCal . Giebler tested one of Vicenzo Sospiri's F3000 cars over the winter and was the quickest driver in the entire test(35 drivers).

The latest hotshoe to emerge from karting is AJ Allmendinger. Even while he was contesting the BDPS in 2002, he was still karting. I saw him race at Willow Springs last April in ICC. He came in 2nd. The driver who won was a 16-year old kid from Las Vegas. So, I believe we have a lot of talent at the grassroots' level, the problem is that many people don't know about them. However, I believe a lot of this will start changing with the new CART Stars of Tomorrow program.

Cheers,

911

[RTKar]

911, I'm from the midwest and until recently Karting wasn't heard of much. Recently there was a big Karting expo in the Chicago area. I really couldn't tell you how long it's been going on but it was advertised in the Chicago Tribune. Both Memo and Rahal were there. I've been aware of the karting in California for a number of years but out here it doesn't seem too prevalent. I know there's been karting in southern Wisc. for awhile and some talent has been produced.(I think it's the Badger Karting Club or something like that.) Until we see more karting throughout the country our talent production will be reltively limited and the pool of American drivers will be small with NASCAR sucking up most of them. It just seems to me it's beginning to reach the consciousness of the mainstream a little bit more, somewhat similar to the X-Games stuff on ESPN2.

[Napoleon]

Originally posted by RTKar
911, I'm from the midwest and until recently Karting wasn't heard of much.

I would disagree. Maybe you didn't hear much, but it has been strong for years (at least here in Ohio).

[RTKar]

I really haven't heard too much about it in northern Illinois until I read about the Karting Expo that was held recently southwest of Chicago. I don't know of any racing going on north of the city but you're probably right,it's going on, I'm just not aware of it.

[911]

Hey RTKar, if you ever get the chance you should check out the Rock Island Grand Prix. Quite honestly, I'm not sure where it is in Illinois, but outside the Grand Nationals & the Stars of Tomorrow finals, it's probably the biggest karting event in the country. I believe the race is held towards the end of summer. It's a street race and it normally attracts some of the best kart racers in the country. In 2002 there were 254 drivers. Scott Speed won last year's event in one of the top shifterkart categories.

911

[RTKar]

Thanks for the info 911:cool:

[rabbit]

I'm with Napoleon. There is a local kart track (1/8 mile clay oval) that has been getting 120+ karts on a weekly basis for 20 years. And there is a series of street races in some of the local small towns.

[Spicoli]

Originally posted by rabbit
I'm with Napoleon. There is a local kart track (1/8 mile clay oval) that has been getting 120+ karts on a weekly basis for 20 years. And there is a series of street races in some of the local small towns.

And there's also Indoor Karting. We use methanol. Maybe that's why I'm so wrong in the head.:cool:

Seriously - its a good way to get started. Then bust a move into shifters with some used equip, then on from there.

[RTKar]

I remember watching some karting on ESPN2 a few years ago from a velodrome in Indy, it was pretty slick. I know there used to be a street race in Minneapolis but I'm not sure if it's still run. I'd love to see a karting facility, either indoor or outdoor, in the Chicago area. Considering the weather an indoor facility would probably make the most sense and I think it would help increase people's awareness of open wheel racing too.

[Badger]

RTKAR, if you want to check out karting nearest to Chicago, then you can catch oval races in Joliet, a road course in Norway (1 hr 15 min SW of Chicago, and a dirt oval in the western burbs. Norway is where I run and it is one of the best facilities in the country.

[Ziggy]

Take this from an exKarter. Too many sanctioning bodies to start with. The individual tracks need to promote the their season champions in the form of sponsorship into the next level of the Karting sport itself. Many small tracks have weekly races, yet this is usually the beginning and end of a Karter's experiance. To go out and do the major events takes major money and a good street vehicle. Most of the local guys are just guys with family help or several friends who do it for kicks.

Ziggy

PS - Kart racing has been strong in the MidWest for years and years. It is not a spectator sport. It is for participants

[911]

Here's a link to the Rock Island GP:

http://www.rockislandgrandprix.com/

It will be held during the last weekend in August, 2003.

911

[Spicoli]

www.prodrivekarting.com

I know its Indy - but its cool. ;)

[911]

Originally posted by Ziggy
Take this from an exKarter. Too many sanctioning bodies to start with.

Yeah, Zig, that's a HUGE problem w/ karting these days. You have the IKF, WKA, SKUSA, Rotax (although not a sanctioning body, but picking up a lot of popularity in certain parts of the country), etc. Then you have to add the gazillion classes for each of these events. There are so many !#%#^%! classes in karting. Some clubs are starting to eliminate the plethora of classes now, and I believe the Stars of Tomorrow is going in the right direction, as well.