Cosworth Atlantic and Barber Cosworth

[cameraman]

Coming soon to a track near you.
And then there's the job of recreating the ladder system. A plan already is in place for 2006 to replace the current Toyota/Atlantic engine with a new four-cylinder Ford/Cosworth engine. The intention is to produce a cheaper, more powerful engine so that the new Atlantic formula will be less expensive and at least equally if not more effective at graduating drivers to Champ cars. Expected in 2007 is a new entry-level, Ford/Cosworth-engined formula that will form the first rung on the Champ Car ladder, replacing the moribund Barber/Dodge series. Also needed is a replacement for the equally dead Barber Big Scholarship program to help young drivers make the critical jump from karts to cars.

Gordon Kirby's Inside Track (http://www.champcarworldseries.com/News/Article.asp?ID=8938)

[coolhand]

A 3.0 liter 4 banger generating 300 ponies needing only 1 rebuild a season costing 100 grand would be perfect and we would see plenty more teams in that seires.

i hope they make a cheap chasis with similar performance to the current one (hint, large tunnels) :thumbup:

[FCYTravis]

3.0 litre 4-banger? :saywhat:

That's a little bit, uh, big? :D

[coolhand]

3.0 litre 4-banger? :saywhat:

That's a little bit, uh, big? :D

cheapest way to get big power, right?

[FCYTravis]

Not really. Four-banger engines that big get massive harmonic vibrations. Nobody builds I4s over 2.5, and even that size is iffy.

Put a moderate-pressure turbocharger on a 2.0 and you'll easily hit 300.

Then you have the question of "Atlantic" homologation - it would be necessary to either rename the series, convince the SCCA to let in 300-hp motors (fat chance) or have two completely different Atlantic specifications - which is asking for disaster.

[nrc]

Not really. Four-banger engines that big get massive harmonic vibrations. Nobody builds I4s over 2.5, and even that size is iffy.
It's not iffy, it's offy. Old School! 250cid four bangers, baby!

Toyota and Chevy have put 2.7 and 2.8 liter 4 bangers in trucks. In general, you're right, anything over 2.5 is pushing it. Cosworth sells kits for the Focus 2.3 that pump it up to 300hp so there's really no need to go beyond that.


Then you have the question of "Atlantic" homologation - it would be necessary to either rename the series, convince the SCCA to let in 300-hp motors (fat chance) or have two completely different Atlantic specifications - which is asking for disaster.
That's the problem for Champ car. I'm sure that they'd like to keep the Formula Atlantic moniker, but the best thing for the ladder would be to start from scratch and create something faster and cheaper.

[Easy]

Expected in 2007 is a new entry-level, Ford/Cosworth-engined formula that will form the first rung on the Champ Car ladder, replacing the moribund Barber/Dodge series.

Hmmm. A mid-level development series powered by a Ford I-4. What a revolutionary concept! I can't believe this hasn't been attempted before.

[pchall]

3.0 litre 4-banger? :saywhat:

That's a little bit, uh, big? :D

Just try telling that to the Offy fanatics at TF.... let's see -- they used to run four bangers up to 4.2l in Hoosierville.

[FCYTravis]

CHUGCHUGCHUGCHUGCHUGCHUGCHUGCHUGCHUG...

Tractor motors, baybee. The future of racing!

[FCYTravis]

Hmmm. A mid-level development series powered by a Ford I-4. What a revolutionary concept! I can't believe this hasn't been attempted before.
Amazing, isn't it? It's almost like nobody ever thought of putting Ford Focus Zetec motors into older formula cars that had a motor which shared the Zetec's bolt pattern.

Astounding!


:gomer: :shakehead :rolleyes:

[Easy]

Amazing, isn't it? It's almost like nobody ever thought of putting Ford Focus Zetec motors into older formula cars that had a motor which shared the Zetec's bolt pattern.

Astounding!


:gomer: :shakehead :rolleyes:


I bet it would really make a great, lower-cost alternative to Star Mazda and run at big events like the ALMS and the ChampCar GP of Cleveland.

[Sean O'Gorman]

More than likely the engine will be a low-powered, fragile, expensive unit only available through one outlet that gouges on the price. All in the name of developing future stars, right?

[Fio1]

Another junior series? Just what we need, another $250,000 a year series that promises the world and delivers nothing with a 12 car grid. :rolleyes:

Honestly, what do you get if you win the F.BMW, F.Renault, FF2000, F.Mazda, Barber National or F.Atlantic series?

[Easy]

Honestly, what do you get if you win the F.BMW, F.Renault, FF2000, F.Mazda, Barber National or F.Atlantic series?

If your parents have enough money you can move up and continue racing.

But slightly more realistically:

FBMW US -Funded drive in ... FBMW Germany.

FRenault US -De-Funked

FF2k -Ride in the Daytona 24 in a Multimatic Ford DP

Star Mazda -Used to get a test in the Panoz LMP-1 but I don't know anymore.

Barber Nat'l -$100k to use toward racing.

TAtlantic -One off in Champ Car Mexico City GP.

[Beevis]

Honestly, what do you get if you win the F.BMW, F.Renault, FF2000, F.Mazda, Barber National or F.Atlantic series?The opportunity to spend gobs of more money.

[FCYTravis]

I bet it would really make a great, lower-cost alternative to Star Mazda and run at big events like the ALMS and the ChampCar GP of Cleveland.
BRILLIANT!!!!!!

Oh, and if you win Star Mazda you get $100,000 cash and a new RX-8. Sell the RX8 and you're only $125,000 in the hole for the year. :rolleyes:

(P.S.: A ride in a Multimatic Ford DP is only slightly less career-killing than driving in the Infiniti Pro Series.)

[Sean O'Gorman]

(P.S.: A ride in a Multimatic Ford DP is only slightly less career-killing than driving in the Infiniti Pro Series.)

Of course, if you could make that sled go fast you might actually get noticed...

[pchall]

A 3.0 liter 4 banger generating 300 ponies needing only 1 rebuild a season costing 100 grand would be perfect and we would see plenty more teams in that seires.

i hope they make a cheap chasis with similar performance to the current one (hint, large tunnels) :thumbup:


Cosworth could probably supply a 2.3l Duratec 4 that produces a hundred horsepower more than the current Atlantics engine with a reasonable price and good longevity. They got 330HP out of a similarly sized M-B DOHC 4 nearly 20 years.