Kalkhoven should talk to Patrick Faure

[cameraman]

The Renault F1 team managed to turn a $5,000,000 profit on their 2004 season.

A team turning a profit, what an odd concept :rolleyes:

[trauma1]

The Renault F1 team managed to turn a $5,000,000 profit on their 2004 season.

A team turning a profit, what an odd concept :rolleyes:
i really think you meant ftg, earl loses are much greater thatn KK's :thumdown:

[cameraman]

i really think you meant ftg, earl loses are much greater thatn KK's :thumdown: You really should consider getting some help about your FTG fixation.

No CCWS team turned a $5,000,000 dollar profit last year. I doubt any of them turned any kind of a profit with the possible exception of Newman Haas. The concept of a CCWS team turning an operational profit would be a laudable goal.

[trauma1]

overdose on koolaide or bagdad bob fronting you $$$$ to post bs, FTG is a pos, scumbag period and remember ftg has lost ten times the yen than kk has, remember kk isn't coked up when he does his deals, so what's your fixation with KK's $$$$, and by the way KK has already stated that they are going to be making a profit this year

[cameraman]

overdose on koolaide or bagdad bob fronting you $$$$ to post bs, FTG is a pos, scumbag period and remember ftg has lost ten times the yen than kk has, remember kk isn't coked up when he does his deals, so what's your fixation with KK's $$$$, and by the way KK has already stated that they are going to be making a profit this year

Unlike you I do not care about FTG. I am not talking about FTG, I am not comparing anything to FTG. This is a Champ Car forum, the only person talking about FTG is you. Why don't you shut the **** up about FTG.

The Renault team (they are in Formula One, ever heard of it?) turned a profit in the most stupidly expensive series on the planet. That is a good thing. I don't think PKV (that would be a racing team not a series) turned a $5,000,000 dollar profit on their GulfStream sponsorship. I can guarantee you Dale Coyne and HVM sure as hell didn't.

Patrick Faure (the team president at Renault) is one hell of a good businessman if he can turn a profit in F1. Champ Car teams could learn a thing or two from Renault when it comes to marketing. That also would be a good thing.

[nrc]

Not sure what Tony George has to do with this.

Ultimately the teams have to be at last able to break even for Champ car to succeed. Do you really think that this is something that isn't part of Champ car's planning?

Do you really think an F1 team is an appropriate yardstick for where Champ car needs to be? A $5 million dollar profit on a how many million dollar budget? If you look at it in terms of ROI I wouldn't be surprised if Newman Haas comes out ahead.

[Sean O'Gorman]

Uh, wouldn't ALL Champ Car teams ultimately need to be profitable in order to survive?

My guess is that aside from Kalkhoven, Forsythe, Gentilozzi, and Russo, most of them are.


overdose on koolaide or bagdad bob fronting you $$$$ to post bs, FTG is a pos, scumbag period and remember ftg has lost ten times the yen than kk has, remember kk isn't coked up when he does his deals, so what's your fixation with KK's $$$$, and by the way KK has already stated that they are going to be making a profit this year

Can someone translate this for me? :saywhat:

[cameraman]

Not sure what Tony George has to do with this.
Not a damn thing. I didn't bring him up.

Do you really think an F1 team is an appropriate yardstick for where Champ car needs to be? A $5 million dollar profit on a how many million dollar budget? If you look at it in terms of ROI I wouldn't be surprised if Newman Haas comes out ahead. You can also look at it as how much did they have to sell to recover a few hundred million dollars? Look at the marketing machine that is Renault. Look at the quantity and quality of the Renault swag that is available. The stands at Barcelona were solid blue with Renault team ware.

The last Champ Car race I went to had nothing at all available for Herdez and the pickings for the other teams was slim to nil. There is a market for CCWS stuff, it may not be NASCAR huge but it is there, but the CCWS teams don't offer much to choose from. It is getting better this year but it has a long way to go.

[Ferdman]

No CCWS team turned a $5,000,000 dollar profit last year. I doubt any of them turned any kind of a profit with the possible exception of Newman Haas. The concept of a CCWS team turning an operational profit would be a laudable goal.

Maybe you should take a look at margins or rates of return rather than straight out numbers. With F1 budgets in the hundreds of millions of dollars, a $5Mil profit ain't something worth crowing about. Say the budget was $230Mil, that 5Mil is a 2.2% profit margin. At least they're not losing money, but BFD, a little over two percent.

ChampCar budgets are fractionally less. It takes about 5Mil to run a single ChampCar. Say Newman Haas's budget is 12Mil for two cars, with the same rate of return as Team Renault, they'd be getting back $264,000.

Maybe you should stick to your camera. When you've turned around a money losing entity into a profitable multi-billion dollar one, then maybe we'll listen to you.

[racer2c]

I wouldn't worry too much about T-shirt sales right now.

[trauma1]

Unlike you I do not care about FTG. I am not talking about FTG, I am not comparing anything to FTG. This is a Champ Car forum, the only person talking about FTG is you. Why don't you shut the **** up about FTG.

The Renault team (they are in Formula One, ever heard of it?) turned a profit in the most stupidly expensive series on the planet. That is a good thing. I don't think PKV (that would be a racing team not a series) turned a $5,000,000 dollar profit on their GulfStream sponsorship. I can guarantee you Dale Coyne and HVM sure as hell didn't.

Patrick Faure (the team president at Renault) is one hell of a good businessman if he can turn a profit in F1. Champ Car teams could learn a thing or two from Renault when it comes to marketing. That also would be a good thing.

I forgot!!! your the thought police, next time i'll submite my post via Pm for yout approval, i really don't think KK needs to take a lesson from F1 on how to make profits, he's demonstated that he can and has the track record, next your the one who started down this road, you say it's a champ car forum, then why bring up the F1 and kk other than rip him, and insinuate that KK needs a lesson on how to make $$$$, just moronic comparision and a BS thread,

[rabbit]

:rolleyes:

[trauma1]

Renault makes a profit of $5m
The Renault F1 team made a profit of $5m in 2004, according to the latest financial results. It is the first time that the Anglo-French team has made a profit since it was acquired from the Benetton company in 2002. The profits were due to increased sponsorship income, a bigger commitment from the team's parent company Renault and, presumably more income resulting from better results.

now if KK increased a bigger commitment from the parent company, cossie plus sponsorship and other income , he's in the same boat, 5 mil sounds real good, they don't say how much the parent company Renault is giving, so this is misleading as hell, it's how Menard got wacked by the IRS creative bookkeeping

[nrc]

Lets stick to the topic and leave personal attacks out of it. If you think the point isn't worthy of discussion it's fair to say so and explain why. Commentary on what you think that says about the original poster isn't necessary.

[cameraman]

Okay here is my point. (Which I didn't make or even mention :rolleyes: earlier.)

Renault has the best souvenir marketing of any team in F1 (ignoring Ferrari which isn't a team, it is a religion). And no, they did not balance their 250+ million dollar budget on tee shirt sales. Which does not change the fact that they have an excellently run and highly profitable marketing group with a fantastic array of swag available to their fans.

This is the 2005 CCWS product list:

RuSport has a hat and a tee shirt
Forsythe has a good selection.
Newman Haas has two shirts and a hat plus the stuff left over from 1993
PKV has a hat and a shirt
RocketSports has a hat and a shirt
HVM nothing
Dale Coyne nothing
Mi-Jack nothing
Australia/Walker nothing other than some old Reynards

I think that there is a market for Champ Car team merchandise, and I think Champ Car teams could learn a thing or two from Renault's choice of and quality of the products they choose to market to their fans.

And no I don't expect KK to drop his negotiations to buy Long Beach so he can design tee shirts. But Champ Car as a series should work with the teams to generate more things for people to buy. Working alone they don't have the volume but as a group they could generate some good things. They have a chance to make some profit while increasing the public's awareness of the series.

They should at least make the attempt.

[Steve99]

I'd like to see how the books show that the Renault team made a profit. Are they considered separate from Renault corporate? How much did Renault help the team? Free engines? Free engineers? I watch every F1 qualifying session and race but I'm not even sure who their sponsors are. The cars are blue and yellow, and probably have some ciggy name on them.

[cameraman]

I watch every F1 qualifying session and race but I'm not even sure who their sponsors are.

I am sure the folks making Mild Sevens would be just thrilled to hear that.

[racer2c]

I am sure the folks making Mild Sevens would be just thrilled to hear that.

I guess thy would be sad to hear that I don't smoke also.

[sundaydriver2]

Okay here is my point. (Which I didn't make or even mention :rolleyes: earlier.)

Renault has the best souvenir marketing of any team in F1 (ignoring Ferrari which isn't a team, it is a religion). And no, they did not balance their 250+ million dollar budget on tee shirt sales. Which does not change the fact that they have an excellently run and highly profitable marketing group with a fantastic array of swag available to their fans.

This is the 2005 CCWS product list:

RuSport has a hat and a tee shirt
Forsythe has a good selection.
Newman Haas has two shirts and a hat plus the stuff left over from 1993
PKV has a hat and a shirt
RocketSports has a hat and a shirt
HVM nothing
Dale Coyne nothing
Mi-Jack nothing
Australia/Walker nothing other than some old Reynards

I think that there is a market for Champ Car team merchandise, and I think Champ Car teams could learn a thing or two from Renault's choice of and quality of the products they choose to market to their fans.

And no I don't expect KK to drop his negotiations to buy Long Beach so he can design tee shirts. But Champ Car as a series should work with the teams to generate more things for people to buy. Working alone they don't have the volume but as a group they could generate some good things. They have a chance to make some profit while increasing the public's awareness of the series.

They should at least make the attempt.

Cart before the horse. Champ Car has only been around for about 15 months. I'm sure KK and GF are aware of merchandising possibilities but I think they are concentrating on putting the series back on track before they worry about T-Shirt sales.

[Sean O'Gorman]

I am sure the folks making Mild Sevens would be just thrilled to hear that.

Something tells me that Mild Sevens' sales in this country wont change much if a US fan can't read their logo...