View Full Version : Stupid, Stupid, Stupid...
I know, let's make the track even WIDER! :shakehead
AND, corner workers...what should Tracy's punishment be for that little cross-track rant? (speaking of stupid) :rolleyes:
fourrunner
08-14-05, 05:14 PM
Must be tough being a Safety Worker when a Driver is Tempermental
But I guess I can understand the driver also .. the safety workers are pushing & prodding and grabbing his arms ... and He's just gotten out of a Heavy Hit & Intensity of leading, then nothing !
I'm guessing they'll take that under consideration & he'll get a warning!!
coolhand
08-14-05, 05:47 PM
i missed that part, what was tracy doing after he got out of the car? he would not get in the truck and then did what?
I think everyone will understand that Paul was angry at himself. His reaction was no different than any other athelete's under the same circumstances. I've seen baseball pitchers tear up dugouts after giving up home runs. I've seen football players knock over benches after fumbling. It happens.
Really. It was no big deal.
indyfan31
08-14-05, 06:02 PM
AND, corner workers...what should Tracy's punishment be for that little cross-track rant? (speaking of stupid) :rolleyes:
A nice 5 digit fine should make the point.
fourrunner
08-14-05, 06:09 PM
He'll probably get called to the woodshed ... that's about it !!!
i missed that part, what was tracy doing after he got out of the car? he would not get in the truck and then did what?
Refused a ride to the care center and ran across the track. He threw a tantrum and it was over. Prolly running back to mommy. ;)
-Kevin
coolhand
08-14-05, 06:46 PM
Vasser looked pissed while he was still in the car in the tire barrier on lap 1
Opposite Lock
08-14-05, 06:55 PM
Vasser looked pissed while he was still in the car in the tire barrier on lap 1
go figure. :shakehead
coolhand
08-14-05, 07:10 PM
go figure. :shakehead
yeah, but i wonder if he knew it was his teammate/employee's fault :gomer:
yeah, but i wonder if he knew it was his teammate/employee's fault :gomer:
Actually, his wiggle started the whole fiasco. I looked @ it several times (PVR recording), and it appears that his big wiggle going into T1 moved Tags into CDM, which forced CDM into the banzai move into T1 (ala Greg Moore @ Portland). Looked like Jeemy was more pizzled that he wasn't pushed sooner. Ah well. CDM just ain't havin' much luck since Cleveburg. :(
-Kevin
TravelGal
08-14-05, 08:53 PM
^^^ I wondered about that but I decided that it was Justin (?) letting up a little that gave Tag the momentary pause, which actually took him to the right. Vasser was pretty much wiggling away out there all on his own.
Of course, I'm a Vasser fan so you can factor that in to my conclusion. ;)
It was "No big deal"?! I beg to differ, and can't even begin to compare it to a ball player trashing a dug-out. Maybe it IS time for PT to move on.
coolhand
08-14-05, 09:02 PM
It was "No big deal"?! I beg to differ, and can't even begin to compare it to a ball player trashing a dug-out. Maybe it IS time for PT to move on.
whats with the PT hate? Explain why he needs to move on? Many people enjoy watching him and he is the only driver out there that shows so much personality. Him to NASCAR would be a huge gain to them, he is the only non-american driver out there who can be real successful with those guys.
coolhand
08-14-05, 10:01 PM
Firt turn pics
http://www.champcarworldseries.com/content/photos/2005/By800/20050814P_0018.jpg
http://www.champcarworldseries.com/content/photos/2005/By800/20050814P_0024.jpg
Ahhhh...no PT hate, he just keeps reminding me of why he's only lucked into one title. I have NEVER denied his speed, skill or popularity, but the personality that has helped MAKE him so popular has also lost him many a race AND possibly a title or 3. I disagree with those who think his moving to NASCAB will be a disaster of sorts for ChampCar. I see SO much in the future of the series, now that I think he WILL soon move on. That was no "get out" wish on my part, more like a prediction, I guess. I don't think Derek Daly is a Tracy hater, either but his assessment of PT today was brutally honest...and accurate. He'll be fine and I wish him success wherever he goes, which is more than many of you said about a lot of other guys!
Revealing pics...Tracy pushed Bourdais WAY wide, I'd say, by design. Sebastian thought so. Then Tracy blames Glock for slowing him up and causing him to lose concentration, so he hits a wall? To his credit PT eventually takes full blame for his own frustration and what it led to. I'd like to also hear more about "the crossing". Anger is no excuse...there is a reason why workers reach out to touch/hold/grab drivers after an incident...you just SAW it!
Geez...now I can see why the camera on the 9 car quit working! Though small, those stands look really full. 62,595 reported in Old Kentuck, how'd WE do? The big boys sounded pretty happy!
fourrunner
08-14-05, 10:38 PM
Revealing pics...Tracy pushed Bourdais WAY wide, I'd say, by design. Sebastian thought so. Then Tracy blames Glock for slowing him up and causing him to lose concentration, so he hits a wall? To his credit PT eventually takes full blame for his own frustration and what it led to. I'd like to also hear more about "the crossing". Anger is no excuse...there is a reason why workers reach out to touch/hold/grab drivers after an incident...you just SAW it!
It's the Safety guys job to touch, hold & grab the Driver after the incident .. It's the Drivers job to focus intently on his job of Racing ... some guys cool down quickly some guys don't ... sure he shouldn't disrespect the volunteers ... Maybe he went back and apologized to them ... who knows !!
I doubt fining Tracy 10,000.00 would make him collapse in financial agony, and they can't fine him anymore than they've fined anyone else anyway ...If they've fined anyone else (Champ Car has only been in existence for 1 1/2 seasons)
I figure they'll be paying Tracy many extra Millions to stay in Champ Car Next year & beyond ...
devilmaster
08-14-05, 11:24 PM
He'll be fine and I wish him success wherever he goes, which is more than many of you said about a lot of other guys!
Well, perhaps I shouldn't speak for the "WE like you do Niz, but there have been many a driver in many a series who have ignored the safety and corner workers. I never remember reading comments that they should 'move-on' because of their actions... till now. :shakehead
There are times when drivers have pulled, yanked, pushed, yelled and even swung at the safety and corner workers.
It isn't a big deal until someone tries to make it one, niz. (oh and I'll try what you did and speak for the "US" among us, whoever they may be.)
coolhand
08-14-05, 11:37 PM
Ahhhh...no PT hate, he just keeps reminding me of why he's only lucked into one title. I have NEVER denied his speed, skill or popularity, but the personality that has helped MAKE him so popular has also lost him many a race AND possibly a title or 3. I disagree with those who think his moving to NASCAB will be a disaster of sorts for ChampCar. I see SO much in the future of the series, now that I think he WILL soon move on. That was no "get out" wish on my part, more like a prediction, I guess. I don't think Derek Daly is a Tracy hater, either but his assessment of PT today was brutally honest...and accurate. He'll be fine and I wish him success wherever he goes, which is more than many of you said about a lot of other guys!
hey I would have the upmost respect for Tracy if he goes to NASCAR. I will cheer him on over there, but Champ Car without him makes me feel different about Champ car, it would appear juvenile in comparision to the series tracy raced in. No big names or men from the 90s would be left. I can see that he feels he has outgrown the series and he has NASCAR written all over him. it just wouldn't be the same, whether you like him or hate him
Jervis Tetch 1
08-14-05, 11:51 PM
hey I would have the upmost respect for Tracy if he goes to NASCAR. I will cheer him on over there, but Champ Car without him makes me feel different about Champ car, it would appear juvenile in comparision to the series tracy raced in. No big names or men from the 90s would be left. I can see that he feels he has outgrown the series and he has NASCAR written all over him. it just wouldn't be the same, whether you like him or hate him :thumbup:
coolhand
08-14-05, 11:54 PM
Revealing pics...Tracy pushed Bourdais WAY wide, I'd say, by design. Sebastian thought so. Then Tracy blames Glock for slowing him up and causing him to lose concentration, so he hits a wall? To his credit PT eventually takes full blame for his own frustration and what it led to. I'd like to also hear more about "the crossing". Anger is no excuse...there is a reason why workers reach out to touch/hold/grab drivers after an incident...you just SAW it!
yeah i just re-watched the race and there was no crossing in the race director feed.
coolhand
08-14-05, 11:58 PM
:thumbup:
http://forum.rscnet.org/attachment.php?attachmentid=304833
this picture says it all
Paul crossing the track was a big deal. He had just taken a pretty good hit and should have sat in the truck for a few minutes for his own good. He should not have crossed the track and not just for his own good but for the good of any driver that may be coming along and runs into him.
Maybe next time he needs a push, the safety team will be a little slow in getting him going again.
I think the safety team is paid and not volunteers. The club workers are not allowed on a hot track while a Champ Car or Toyota Atlantic session is on.
Revealing pics...Tracy pushed Bourdais WAY wide, I'd say, by design. Sebastian thought so. Tracy looks to be about one tire width outside the paint just past the apex. Looks to me like Tracy took the normal line, Bourdais tried to stay outside and couldn't make it stick.
I think there's a standard fine for crossing a hot track. Tracy should get that plus maybe a bit added on for failure to obey the safety workers. But it's not like he did anything that hasn't been done before. I'm not sure what's got your dander up.
Tracy flat blew it. It's a shame because I would have liked to have seen a championship battle to the wire. Now Seabass would have to drop out of a couple of races early for Tracy to have a chance.
Sorry...no PT hate here, no desire for him to leave (in fact, just the opposite.) and no dander. Perhaps I should have "taken some time in the truck" too? I think I may be reacting to years of reading vitriol and hate on these forums directed at other drivers who do no more or less than Paul Tracy does on a seemingly regular basis. He often is given a pass because he's, well...PT! Blind loyalty? I don't know. I will never forget HIS support and loyalty for ChampCar during it's darkest days when it was needed most. He's a strong character, alright, but too often ruled by emotion rather than good judgement. Now, shall I start in on Cristiano! ;) Avoidable contact!!? :eek:
fourrunner
08-15-05, 08:30 AM
Dumbest thing I ever saw DaMatta do ... It really didn't make logical sense ... He said people lifted off the gas ... well maybe he should have done the same ...Of course it's easy to say this with Replays & Overhead camera shots, and I'm sure DaMatta was just as pumped up as Paul ...
Every Driver should think every moment of the Race ... But they are Human... and sometimes the emotions of the moment run away from you :)
Sebastian makes mistakes too ... but it just sounds "more romantic" when he whines about it in that French Accent ! ;)
pfc_m_drake
08-15-05, 08:44 AM
Just FYI, many times drivers have a clause in their contracts that stipulate that the team will pay any fines imposed on the driver by the sanctioning body. Given PT's stature, I'm sure he has such a clause in his contract. Therefore, even if he is fined for the incident, chances are that it's not going to come out of his pocket anyway.
oddlycalm
08-15-05, 02:29 PM
This is what makes PT Mr. Excitement. He can have a comfortable lead in the home stretch and toss it all away out of frustration over something minor like a driver he's about to lap not moving right over. Doesn't even need the pressure of another driver on this tail. Tracey drives in the moment, not as part of some broader plan or strategy which is generally exciting if not always the wisest choice. Of course this also means that he says what he thinks about the EARL and pretty much everything else as well. :thumbup:
oc
TravelGal
08-15-05, 04:09 PM
Sebastian makes mistakes too ... but it just sounds "more romantic" when he whines about it in that French Accent ! ;)
No it doesn't. :p
But we sure agree on DeMatta.
Sebastian makes mistakes too ... but it just sounds "more romantic" when he whines about it in that French Accent ! ;)
He certainly served up a fine French whine after qualifying. :D
They HAVE to teach that boy how to say...Mic-DON-alds. There's a lot at stake here!
coolhand
08-15-05, 11:38 PM
http://www.motorsport.com/photos/champcar/2005/den/champcar-2005-den-kd-1717.jpg
http://www.motorsport.com/photos/champcar/2005/den/champcar-2005-den-kd-1718.jpg
http://www.motorsport.com/photos/champcar/2005/den/champcar-2005-den-kd-1721.jpg
that could have been ugly
formulaben
08-16-05, 12:28 AM
that could have been ugly
As far as I'm concerned it WAS ugly...luckily we have strong roll hoops. :(
cameraman
08-16-05, 12:30 AM
Wilson is lucky he still has his head :eek:
Wilson said the wheel was spinning on his head. :eek:
IMO, PT should get a large fine for dismissing the safety crew. When you become a pedestrian on the track, the safety crew owns you! They become your boss.
Tony Cotman has done brilliantly this year letting the guys race, trying to avoid FCY's, etc. All while keeping it safe. He needs to put a smackdown on PT for this.
JMO.
Andrew Longman
08-16-05, 11:33 AM
I'm willing to cut PT some slack on this. I don't like it but I accept that certain drivers get different treatment because the sport and fans want it that way. (I watched Tony Stewart drive into the side I Vickers' car on Saturday but, unless I missed it, NASCAR did nothing, no doubt because he's hot right now).
I also feel bad because his race and championship probably went out the window on Sunday.
But if CC wanted to make sure this behavior stopped they could. What's the fine for not putting the steering wheel back in F1? $50,000? Whatever it is, you ALWAYS see drivers put the wheel back on no matter how pissed they are.
TKGAngel
08-16-05, 12:13 PM
Wilson said the wheel was spinning on his head. :eek:
IMO, PT should get a large fine for dismissing the safety crew. When you become a pedestrian on the track, the safety crew owns you! They become your boss.
Tony Cotman has done brilliantly this year letting the guys race, trying to avoid FCY's, etc. All while keeping it safe. He needs to put a smackdown on PT for this.
JMO.
I agree. Sure PT may have been PO'd, but that's no way to act towards the safety crew. A smackdown is definitely deserving.
I remember Wilson said that his helmet had a black mark from front to back on it from the car going up and over. This situation reminds me of Mid-Ohio or Elkhart Lake (all I remember is that it was a natural terrain track) a few years ago, where Herta ended up with a car directly on top of him, and Herta was stationary and slightly off-course at the time. Props to the car designers, since the Wilson situation could have been ugly.
JohnnyQ
08-17-05, 10:53 AM
I think Tracy got caught with his pants down on the start. I was shocked that Seabass didn't turn into him. I've been watching Glock's driving and he drives like a god damn idiot. That m'fer should just put his head down and throw down some laps. He'd be much better if they sent him out without mirrors.
trying to avoid FCY
Just because he is a Grand Am fanboy doesn't mean that....
:gomer:
This situation reminds me of Mid-Ohio or Elkhart Lake (all I remember is that it was a natural terrain track) a few years ago, where Herta ended up with a car directly on top of him, and Herta was stationary and slightly off-course at the time.
That was at RA and, if memory serves, it was Alex Barron who tried to mount Herta.
TKGAngel
08-17-05, 07:35 PM
That was at RA and, if memory serves, it was Alex Barron who tried to mount Herta.
:D
Thanks for filling in the gaps in my memory.
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