IRL Phoenix Ratings are in...

[racer2c]

a 1.5 with a three share. Down from a 1.8 four share at Homestead.

I don't know where to find CART ratings.

BTW, arena football got a 1.9.
link (http://www.sportsbusinessnews.com/sections/index.asp?sId=6&sStoryId=24311&selectDate=3/25/2003)

[JLMannin]

From the same website:

CART's lack of acceptance is puzzling, especially when the alternative is IRL (http://www.sportsbusinessnews.com/sections/index.asp?sId=21&sStoryId=24202&selectDate=)

Lots of quotes from Paul Tracy. And overall, a fairly positive (yet accurate) article on CART.

[Railbird]

I don't know where to find CART ratings.

and in truth, you don't want to know, openwheel ratings are in the tank.

If you want to brag about ratings I suggest buying some lil E gear and joining the Nascar Nation.

[Ziggy]

How many TV sets does Speedvision even reach? 4 million or so....

They cant even trot out the old "every man, woman and dog in China was tuned in" anymore.....

both were crummy, both with eye's watching and eye's in the stands

Thanks Tony, your a genius. While taking over openwheel racing, you killed it.

Ziggy

[racer2c]

Originally posted by Railbird
I don't know where to find CART ratings.

and in truth, you don't want to know, openwheel ratings are in the tank.

If you want to brag about ratings I suggest buying some lil E gear and joining the Nascar Nation.

Old news 'bird. The interest in current ratings is to monitor the well publicized 'growth' that comes from the IRL spin, I mean PR room.

I believe that Tony was under the impression that if he could obtain Honda and Toyota (which he did) and the big CART Teams (Which he did) and some big open wheel stars (which he did) his series would instantly be back where it was in '95 (which it isn't). Go figure.

[Racewriter]

Originally posted by racer2c
Old news 'bird. The interest in current ratings is to monitor the well publicized 'growth' that comes from the IRL spin, I mean PR room.

I believe that Tony was under the impression that if he could obtain Honda and Toyota (which he did) and the big CART Teams (Which he did) and some big open wheel stars (which he did) his series would instantly be back where it was in '95 (which it isn't). Go figure.

It's not even back to where it was in 1996 or 1997...

[JSR]

Originally posted by racer2c
Old news 'bird. The interest in current ratings is to monitor the well publicized 'growth' that comes from the IRL spin, I mean PR room.


I do believe the 1.5 is higher than last years race. I believe I read somewhere that it got a 1.2. I do know that the Nascar ratings were down from last year.

[Turn7]

Those marginal increases/decreases are nothing but the change of the sampling. The accuracy range for ratings is larger than the difference in the change. The number is meaningless if you are trying to indicate "growth" and/or "loss" of viewers.

[mnkywrch]

Originally posted by JLMannin
From the same website:

CART's lack of acceptance is puzzling, especially when the alternative is IRL (http://www.sportsbusinessnews.com/sections/index.asp?sId=21&sStoryId=24202&selectDate=)

Lots of quotes from Paul Tracy. And overall, a fairly positive (yet accurate) article on CART.


"I felt the IRL opener was terrible and we had a good start to the season," said Tracy, who won CART's opener.

Maybe for him, but I thought St. Pete was a joke. The last half was a snooze and the conclusion settled once Bourdais messed up. The last half of that race made even the Phoenix crashfest exciting - much less DeFerran chasing down Dixon.

I know it will take time for CART to get back to where it was, but they just don't have the depth in drivers or teams yet.

[racer2c]

Originally posted by mnkywrch
Maybe for him, but I thought St. Pete was a joke. The last half was a snooze and the conclusion settled once Bourdais messed up. The last half of that race made even the Phoenix crashfest exciting - much less DeFerran chasing down Dixon.

I know it will take time for CART to get back to where it was, but they just don't have the depth in drivers or teams yet.

Hmm, I could have sworn that you gave St Pete a virtual thumbs up the day after the race. Am I mistaken?

[pchall]

Originally posted by racer2c
Hmm, I could have sworn that you gave St Pete a virtual thumbs up the day after the race. Am I mistaken?

Race evaluations are relative to expectations. Lots of CART fans are pleased with the PT show up front and the mid-field action in the two races so far.

Meanwhile, IRL fans are still waiting for the bazillion meaningless position changes on the high banked ovals. Whatever floats their collective boat, I suppose...

[Racewriter]

For perspective (all Phoenix IRL races have been on ABC):

1996: 2.2
1997: 1.8
1998: 1.9

[RaceGrrl]

Originally posted by mnkywrch
Maybe for him, but I thought St. Pete was a joke. The last half was a snooze and the conclusion settled once Bourdais messed up. The last half of that race made even the Phoenix crashfest exciting - much less DeFerran chasing down Dixon.


Oh really? Well... maybe you have a short memory, but vBulletin remembers everything. On 2/23 you posted this, after the St.Pete race:

I enjoyed it.

I hope to see some kind of mid-field develop that can occasionally contend, though - it still seems like Newman-Haas and Player's are the class of the field.

But it is early in the season.

St Pete thread (http://www.offcamber.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=665)

[pchall]

Yikes!

Major "Whack-a-Lemming" there.

[rabbit]

Originally posted by RaceGrrl
St Pete thread (http://www.offcamber.net/forums/showthread.php?s=&threadid=665) Ouch.:)

[JLMannin]

Since when are evidence and logic admissable in a debate about open wheel racing? :D

[DaveL]

Originally posted by Turn7
Those marginal increases/decreases are nothing but the change of the sampling. The accuracy range for ratings is larger than the difference in the change. The number is meaningless if you are trying to indicate "growth" and/or "loss" of viewers.

Exactly right.

Ratings are sample means so by definition the number you see is not the real number. The difference between a 1.5 and a 1.2 rating is the same as flipping a coin 50 times and getting heads 26 times, and then doing it again and getting heads 27 times.

And the fact remains, the average (whether it's the mean or the median) rating for a network IRL race is lower than what it was the first three years the IRL was around. Only a Lemming can call a lower average rating "growth".

[devilmaster]

Originally posted by pchall
Yikes!

Major "Whack-a-Lemming" there.


Originally posted by rabbit
Ouch.:)

And thats what you call a *SLAM*. :laugh:

Steve

[JLMannin]

They rationalize it as growth by playing up the fact that the number of channels has grown over time, thus diluting the ratings on the already existing channels.

There are two problems with this theory:
1. The number of channels has not increased by 25% in four years, and
2. This same argument is refuted as a defence for declining CART ratings by those same lemmings.

[mnkywrch]

Originally posted by racer2c
Hmm, I could have sworn that you gave St Pete a virtual thumbs up the day after the race. Am I mistaken?

No, you're not.

I liked what I saw at first live but when I watched the whole deal off my TiVo it didn't carry the same punch. I'm pretty sure I've said as much either here or at TF at some point... if I haven't, welcome to my new opinion of St. Pete.

I stand by what I said then, I stand by what I said now. If that's a "slam" or an "ouch" for ya, more power to you.

And it sure didn't compare to Homestead, for my buck. Your mileage may vary.

I'd love to compare it to Monterrey but I've missed it entirely as I was at Phoenix watching some accelerated depreciation thanks to some drivers who were running out of talent. I've never thought much of Monterrey, though... but give me some asphalt and I can give you two more passing zones.

[RaceGrrl]

Originally posted by mnkywrch
...welcome to my new opinion of St. Pete.

Whatever. :rolleyes:

I nailed you and you know it.

[devilmaster]

Uhoh!

Sounds like Mistress Vixen is out and about! :laugh:

Steve

[rabbit]

Well of course it carried more punch live. Duh. Half the fun in racing is the suspense. Will he pit? Not pit? Will the car stay in one piece? Can he catch him? Can he hold him off? What if there's a yellow? What if the race stays green? Racing becomes marginally less interesting when those questions are already answered.

... but I thought St. Pete was a joke. The last half was a snooze and the conclusion settled once Bourdais messed up. ... NS, Sherlock. :shakehead You were watching a replay.

[JSR]

Originally posted by JLMannin

1. The number of channels has not increased by 25% in four years

What was the increase?

[mapguy]

Originally posted by JSR
What was the increase?

Less than 25%.

:D

[mnkywrch]

Originally posted by RaceGrrl
Whatever. :rolleyes:

I nailed you and you know it.

Nailed me on what?

Did I deny my earlier statements? Nope.

Is there a line in the rules for OC that prevent someone from changing their mind? Don't see one.

But if it makes all of you happy, I'll try to remember to start a new thread everytime I change my mind on something.

If you guys are going to "nail me" every time I change my mind I suggest you buy nails in bulk - because I change my mind a lot. Won't bother me in the slightest.

For instance, St. Pete was the best race I'd seen all year until Homestead. Then it was Homestead. Now it's Darlington. I'll let you know when it changes again.

Go back and see how I thought it was a good thing that Pook took over CART. Now I think it's a bad thing because he's decided the future is the streets, not the natural terrain courses I prefer.

Oh, and motorsportstv.com (http://www.motorsportstv.com/tv_ratings.htm) is a good place to look for ratings.

I think I'll enjoy what's left of my vacation now.

[JLMannin]

Originally posted by mapguy
Less than 25%.

:D

Exactly what I was thinking.

[Turn7]

mnky follows that Indy Soap Opera.... As The Vision Turns.

You have to be open to opinion changing if you got visions.

[mapguy]

wrnch, you got caught with your pants down. Suck it up and deal with it. (Or do what I do and not wear any and it won't happen.)

Don't give me any guff or I'll strap into my Cooper and give you the chrome-horn going into Tarzan... :D

I watched all four races and what I saw were two excellent races on C^RT's part and two drone-a-thons for the irl.

Watching the C^RT drivers actually having to drive the cars was really impressive. Sawing at the wheel and playing with the throttle to get traction.

Watching the irl guys was like watching 18-wheelers on the highway. Hell Shiggy finished the race at Phoenix without spinning. A feat he never accomplished driving a ChampCar.

[devilmaster]

Originally posted by Turn7
mnky follows that Indy Soap Opera.... As The Vision Turns.


Or 'As My Stomach Turns....' :rolleyes:

Steve

[JLMannin]

Originally posted by mnkywrch

Nailed me on what?

If you guys are going to "nail me" every time I change my mind I suggest you buy nails in bulk - because I change my mind a lot. Won't bother me in the slightest.
If you had just stopped your message at this point, you would have been ahead. but comments like

Did I deny my earlier statements? Nope.
and

Is there a line in the rules for OC that prevent someone from changing their mind? Don't see one.
and :rolleyes:

But if it makes all of you happy, I'll try to remember to start a new thread everytime I change my mind on something.
and :rolleyes: :shakehead :rolleyes:

For instance, St. Pete was the best race I'd seen all year until Homestead. Then it was Homestead. Now it's Darlington. I'll let you know when it changes again.
indicate to me that it does bother you more than you're willing to admit. :saywhat:

John

[JSR]

Originally posted by mapguy
Less than 25%.

:D

smartazz :D

[devilmaster]

Hey JLMannin,

don't forget.......


Originally posted by Mnkywrch
I think I'll enjoy what's left of my vacation now.

Wahh! http://216.40.249.192/s/cwm/cwm/cwm14.gif

:rolleyes:

Steve

[Hot Rod Otis]

Thanks for the laugh mnkywrch.:laugh: That was some of the best comedy I've read in a while. :laugh: IMHO, a rather lame attempt to CYA, but amusing nonetheless. :laugh:

What pray tell me was so f***ing great about Homestead? Where was all the much hyped IRL side-by-side-wheel-to-wheel racin' were always hearing about? Where were the countless on the track passes for the lead? Had C^RT ran @ Homestead instead of the IRL and the same race occurred all we would have probably heard from you was how boring it was, no passing, and how the race was won with a pass in the pits and not on the track.....blah blah blah.


Keep 'em coming though. Every one a Maserati!!:gomer:

[FortyOneFord]

My only question, why waste vacation time watching earl and participating in a forum about a series he doesn't like?