View Full Version : Mazda/Cosworth Formula Atlantic
Nice! Three year deal to badge the Atlantic engines and buy lots of media time for the ChampCar series. May I suggest some of you might be pleased with that new MazdaSpeed6? Now you have an excuse to go get one. A nice little Redfire Metallic Mazda6 Sportwagon is my daily driver and I can hardly wait to get the Mazda/Cosworth Formula Atlantic official series sticker on it! :thumbup:
AR1 reports Mazda will be "a" series sponsor as well as badging the engine. (The Mazda Formula Atlantic Series? Will the Cosworth name appear?) Atlantic teams are approaching Roshfrans for oil, will pay, but want the company to become a bigger sponsor. Makes sense. David Martinez is said to be close to an Atlantic ride. Be good to have a Mexican connection there, too. Newman/Wachs may run 3 cars instead of two. The Atlantic car is said to be the best car Swift has ever built. The first pic sure makes it look that way. Don't forget to watch! :)
Two Mazdas and a Ford in the driveway. Zoom zoom :thumbup:
Spicoli
02-14-06, 11:33 PM
did NOT see this coming. NICE! :thumbup:
meadors
02-14-06, 11:38 PM
Now we need Mazda Raceway on the schedule too!
trauma1
02-15-06, 01:26 PM
Mazda says it's thier engine not a badging like most think it is they have the engines in most of thier cars
cameraman
02-15-06, 01:55 PM
The MZR engine was designed by Mazda, and is produced both in Hiroshima, Japan and Hermosillo, Mexico. It is used in the company's MAZDA3, MAZDA5, MAZDA6, MAZDASPEED6, Tribute and B-Series, as well as the Ford Focus, Escape, Fusion and Ranger.
The production MZR engine is a Mazda designed engine. They have some quasi official branding for a race version of it in the new(ish) Formula SCCA spec car.
Q. What will the Mazda contract actually do for the competitors?
Free mandatory hats and uniform patches?
trauma1
02-15-06, 02:44 PM
what it is is $$ for cossie instead of KK and GF getting little out of production now mazda pays to have the engines built{ i hope} i see a bit more commitment from mazda than ford is giving cossie to have thier name on the engine
what it is is $$ for cossie instead of KK and GF getting little out of production now mazda pays to have the engines built{ i hope}
The competitors pay for the engine. It's part of the package price. The competitors pay for the Yokohama tires too. But once again, free mandatory hat and patch.
extramundane
02-15-06, 04:24 PM
Further, from Jim Jordan on the SWC Message Board:
It is the same engine we use in the SWC cars (and I did mention the series for a little plug) so we are excited that we get to use it in another venue. It should be a fun program with the ChampCar folks, especially since they are people I have dealt with before.
cameraman
02-15-06, 04:53 PM
The competitors pay for the engine. It's part of the package price. The competitors pay for the Yokohama tires too. But once again, free mandatory hat and patch.
How about they get a series to race in. What did Toyota give the teams for the last decade? What does Renault provide?
Geez, a free hat and jacket patch. You say that like it's a BAD thing!
How about they get a series to race in. What did Toyota give the teams for the last decade? What does Renault provide?
Toyota provided nothing but some cash for time buys on Speed. Mazda will likely do the same. Mazda will get way more out of this than the teams, just like Toyota did. Let's just not get all ccf here and pretend that this is going to be a huge Mazda factory racing program. Its a marketing arrangement that won't help the competitors a great deal.
Renault provides chassis and engine development, series organization, pr, hospitality and TV.
Dr. Corkski
02-15-06, 06:25 PM
Toyota provided nothing but some cash for time buys on Speed. Mazda will likely do the same. Mazda will get way more out of this than the teams, just like Toyota did. Let's just not get all ccf here and pretend that this is going to be a huge Mazda factory racing program. Its a marketing arrangement that won't help the competitors a great deal.5! :D
Mazda's gonna provide all of us posters with hardcards! :gomer:
5! :D
Mazda's gonna provide all of us posters with hardcards! :gomer:
Hard Core for a Hard Card!
btw, I hear College Street Billiards has uh, changed a bit.
AND a MazdaSpeed 3, 274hp 2.3 litre t-4 for '07, in the low to mid 20s. See, they won't be giving those away either.
cameraman
02-15-06, 07:41 PM
Toyota provided nothing but some cash for time buys on Speed. Mazda will likely do the same. Mazda will get way more out of this than the teams, just like Toyota did. Let's just not get all ccf here and pretend that this is going to be a huge Mazda factory racing program. Its a marketing arrangement that won't help the competitors a great deal.
Renault provides chassis and engine development, series organization, pr, hospitality and TV.
Exactly as Renault should as they own the series. Mazda does not own the Atlantics, why do you think they should spend money as though they did?
Mazda said this: "...it has entered into a three-year integrated marketing partnership with the Champ Car Atlantic Championship." It is marketing for the series not the teams. CCAC replaced Toyota with a more interested sponsor at a time when interested sponsors are extremely rare. Why can't you just take it for what it is? Why is nothing ever good enough?
Spicoli
02-15-06, 09:46 PM
comma comma comma http://images.art.com/images/-/Happy-Bunny---All-About-Me--C10136583.jpeg comma comma comma
:thumbup:
Winston Wolfe
02-15-06, 09:48 PM
WHO DAT ? :confused:
So, what does this thing weigh? With only 25 more hp and by the looks of it I guess it'll actually be a slower car? Weren't the F-Mazdas at about 240hp almost as fast as Atlantics at certain tracks? I know raw speed may not be as critical as driver development, but to have a "lower" ladder series end up being faster would make it look like a crooked ladder. I sure have enjoyed all the hype but I was hoping for a more powerful engine. Can't have it all, I guess, and still make it affordable?
Exactly as Renault should as they own the series. Mazda does not own the Atlantics, why do you think they should spend money as though they did?
Mazda said this: "...it has entered into a three-year integrated marketing partnership with the Champ Car Atlantic Championship." It is marketing for the series not the teams. CCAC replaced Toyota with a more interested sponsor at a time when interested sponsors are extremely rare. Why can't you just take it for what it is? Why is nothing ever good enough?
You asked about Renault, I'm not comparing.
I am aware that Mazda sees this only as marketing. What I'm trying to point out is that this isn't a major subsidy program that will benefit the teams as many people here seem to be thinking. That's all I'm trying to point out.
Just a little yang to all the yin that Mazda is getting on this board.
And yes, free hats rule. As do free t-shirts.
So, what does this thing weigh? With only 25 more hp and by the looks of it I guess it'll actually be a slower car? Weren't the F-Mazdas at about 240hp almost as fast as Atlantics at certain tracks?
The actual HP figure for the Toyota Engine was 240HP in a 1250 pound car. The only figure I've been able to find for the new car is 1400 pounds on the SierraSierra site. Both figures are with driver. Hopefully that's a rounded up number.
That would still improve the power to weight ratio from .19 to .21.
OK, so 150 lbs, heavier and less power in the old car than I thought. I had 275hp in my head for some reason. I thought Star Mazda was 240. What kind of a difference will .02 lb/hp. make in a lap time? Is that the same as a weight advantage of only 6 lbs. then? If true they should be the same speed? In any case it doesn't look like we can expect a much faster car, unless the chassis is a lot better. I guess we'll have to listen carefully to what Fogarty has to say for a first indication.
I thought Star Mazda was 240. What kind of a difference will .02 lb/hp. make in a lap time? Is that the same as a weight advantage of only 6 lbs. then? If true they should be the same speed?
No, it's a 10% better power to weight ratio. To get the same power to weight as the old car, the new car would have gain 150 more pounds. To have the same power to weight ratio as the new car the old car would have to lose 130 pounds.
To get as sense of the difference you can calculate quarter mile times for the two in a perfect world:
New Car: 10.555 seconds/140.02 mph
Old Car: 10.948 seconds/135.01 mph
So with all other things being equal (which they won't be) the new car would gain 4 tenths on every quarter mile straight.
FCYTravis
02-17-06, 03:22 AM
Plus Star Mazdas have primitive aerodynamics by comparison. Atlantics have tunnels. Huge ones.
:thumbup: (I just worry about stuff I don't understand that well until I see the proof in front of me. I read a post somewhere that said the comparative power/weight was only .217/.214...which is a wash I guess, and aero and chassis tweaks with a higher torque engine should count for something I suppose, especially pulling out of those street course 90s?)
"The new car has surpassed all expectations" after running 2 simulated full race runs at Firebird yesterday. (230mi.) I hope they expected it to be faster! :D More tests today. Anyone have Fogarty's cell #? (he said the car will reward hard driving is more forgiving and it will be easy to slide around a little bit)
:thumbup: (I just worry about stuff I don't understand that well until I see the proof in front of me. I read a post somewhere that said the comparative power/weight was only .217/.214...which is a wash I guess, and aero and chassis tweaks with a higher torque engine should count for something I suppose, especially pulling out of those street course 90s?)
Here's a technical paper from Swift that states the power to weight ratio of the previous generation car as .19. (PDF file)
http://www.swiftengineering.com/02Motorsports/Atlantic/Images/SAE%20Paper%2002MSEC-87.pdf
Thanks. I guess the new car is already lapping Firebird .75 faster than the old car, right out of the box. More to come, I'm sure. Feeling better now. :)
Powered by vBulletin® Version 4.2.5 Copyright © 2024 vBulletin Solutions Inc. All rights reserved.